Read this: The Digital Future: BBC4 CBBC on demand, Telegraph Subs Soar, Fake News 101

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What's on the chopping block subscription is the UK press Ponders the future of news and the cost of living squeeze this information journalist shell shares the BBC's latest efforts to combat fake news quiz we used to be making up for Media that's all coming up in this edition of the media podcast in this week's news to BBC and attorney-general went to court over the details of a story involving an allegedly abusive.

Five Informant BBC was given permission to broadcast to story but without revealing the identity of the accused had partygate leaks continuing to emerge from across the press a TV to BBC Panorama carbonating in Sue Grey Day anymore over the stock market shares of Snapchat owner snap plunged more than 40% on Tuesday dragon, lot of its rivals to Ricky Gervais in the spotlight after jokes his new Netflix special continued his habitat punching down to the LGBT community the comedian Defender need to be comedy was critics are calling for the platform to enforce its policies and remove the potentially harmful content Media stories you need to know about this week.

I've got to media experts here to take through the headlines so first that we've got the co-founder production company daft Doris it's Jaime East hi Jamie how you doing? I'm good I'm good last time I saw you with in Sweden and you were.

The audio radio masses about the smart 7 why not tell are masses about it too.

It's a daily news podcast 7 things you need to know it's 7 in the morning 7 minutes long and it for the daily commute the week before the first lockdown hit the crack on and and laundry anyway, because no one had anything else to do and we did 10 million downloads a couple of weeks ago, so it's been great with expanded into Germany into Ireland and got a fitness one got an entertainment one coming.

It's all good.

Milly is not bad for a lockdown project.

Is it? It's nice that people have adopted as part of their daily habit.

It was always seen as something we knew would always struggle to get people to replace the existing commuting podcast have it with a new one so we designed this to be just think they listen to on the way to the train station on the way to the bus stop and they seem to be going really well.

This is press Gazette editor Charlotte

Hi Charlotte at least say my story and chance you can imagine that there's as people always discounts just industry-wide declining print however.

I'd say the winners in April the Daily Mail and the Daily Mirror they grew ever so slightly marked on which obviously is bucking the trend slightly but then what I was the freeze are still games study and sonnet or even growing their distributions of the sea at slightly different.

It's not a paid print circulation, but the metro city a.m.

Well, I think Sally by their prometric.

They're not having to panicking copies out at the moment with their phones out on the tube in the morning slightly different to 20 years ago.

Pick me up a copy of Metro before.

They go on their journey.

Especially where you've got for example parts of the Jubilee line, now where even underground you can get 4G so shoulder the only happy when that got introduced changes always at the forefront of the media and today is no different this week is no different on Thursday the BBC announcer digital strategy for the broadcaster and the seems to be coming quite a lot of chatter and confusion about what the changes mean.

This is director-general Tim Davie making some announcements heard from the BBC about what they going to be cutting I think they are the headlines and everyone will take away is that the siding through some of that they classed a smaller smaller digital station socib.

I think Radio 4 Extra and BBC4 I think with the ones that I think we'll go on at the most attention and then the last time does now the right doing then they also announce that they just signed on Chris Kamara EuroMillions and like tons of Talent of joined BBC sounds give you 70 cases where there were the place in their chips for the next five years would say they can't do right for doing wrong and there isn't a lot that they could have done.

I think anyone in Tim Davies position would probably have done the same thing that will it will be lots of emotional outcry CBBC going off in this to be pragmatic very much doubt the figures for something like CBBC all Radio 4 Extra on a linear form warranted the costs even just a compliance cost of all that would have been worth it and you know that they can a U-turn of putting BBC 3 back on.

I would argue probably wasn't a great idea.

They should have double down step to that sticks their guns it again.

It was a bit.

I think they're always panicking about having a 6 Music BBC Asian Network style protest and Ferrari about that, but I think in reality they're doing the right thing all of these channels deserve to still find ears and eyes, but how many TV where the cost to just a parent and just waste the BBC News have to do one thing it's a waste money is 285 million of cups and they found 500 million, but they're more into digital journalism perspective.

There's quite a bit of cuts coming to local and regional BBC do you know what what's likely to disappear or change? Yes say interesting l note first that there were only just quite a lot of cuts to journalism in the regions in about 2020.

2028 so for example as well the long-running current affairs programme inside-out was cut at that time and then about at the start of this year.

They introduced basement called we are England that has now been after a few months so that obviously wasn't working in the way they hoped it would in addition local news bulletins in some areas seem to be being cut for example BBC South Today Oxford and also look east Cambridge that operation and coverage of that region is going to be moved to Norwich apparently.

So this is all part of this drive to go digital first.

So essentially what they're saying is they're not necessarily investment in journalism overall, but that less will be in TV and radio and more will be online but I must say I have quite a funny conversation with someone.

As with Elliot when I said them going to be a digital-first BBC they said they haven't said there going to be a digital-first BBC many times already is interesting that sort of still the stage.

We're out a guest music l television S4 the is the changing of the Old Guard music went through a horrible can a transition repaired every period ever ever a decade and is going to come out arguably in rude health and printer still clinging on and the BBC is still cleaning on.

It's just the changing of you know it's like moving away from from press to Photoshop it takes that long to kind of shift at giant industry over it takes bravery and I guess been quite thick skinned about about.

There is going to be blood lost their overall it is but it never to me just have to happen creating a single 24-hour TV news channel is just perfect sense the fact that they had so much going on anyway.

Just Ludacris it makes sense from editorial point of view and from a from a financial point of view as well the fact that managed to find 500 million lbs as savings when they're ready to save 285 goes to show just how much money is washing around in the BBC I think there is still a lot.

I mean when you look at some of the ships of the moving BBC4 online Jamie fever gonna write the channels obituaries broadcast obituary, what would you include? What's it going to be remembered for BBC4 was great great was great.

Did they invent slow TV did they do that weekend? I think that was that was a great one where they just fly around the coast of Britain really in in like real time.

That's great.

You know.

But you know it's nice to know about the shipping forecast isn't it? You know no one uses a shipping forecast for really you know but it's you always know it's there so BBC4 was good at that and you did turn to find stuff on their music band a good home on BBC4 as well on music documentaries on the music programming and the spillover of things like Glastonbury in today with we're grey and old episodes of Top of the Pops of course as well.

Shall we CBBC is probably less of an issue maybe than BBC 4? This is an audience to the Pretty iPlayer first and I need to talk to a 70-year old is somewhat surprised but the idea of linear tell somebody else choosing what you should watch that's the right thing to do is probably move out that channel to be on iPlayer make sense I was surprised by that one and it's sort of like the same to snow about maybe the BBC should have stuck to its guns on keeping BBC3 CBBC viewers viewers forming even more online habits than

BBC three beers so that's completely make sense.

I think the only thing maybe the baby's things that obviously they are meant to be for everyone and I don't I don't have figures with me unfortunately that I wonder if there are like families who you know can't afford smart TVs an iPad and stuff if they'll find it access that content if it's not on TV but yeah, I don't know I just that that would be my mum can send if your 70 plus with a kind of dodgy broadband plan and that you don't really understand watching you know the TV through the internet.

It means less stuff for you though.

Doesn't it? Jamie or at the abandoned those that already don't forget to pay licence fee anyway, so tough.

I think it's is the transition thing you know BBC3 CBB CBBC for generally pretty young or middle-aged internet Savvy

Demos all of those ones you know I mean BBC2 or Radio 2 or something like that.

You know the silver the silver foxes of the crazy about understandably so but this is the way transition in there audience moving and holding time to online or just going where the audience are ready.

I suspect it's a bit of both and a young audience from closing the linear CBBC down.

Don't get what you mean about access, but they have to make a start somewhere a licence for existing colour TV they ploughed millions into making colour programming before before honey anybody had colour TVs you have to make that somewhere other things that there and going to be changing is taking five live off am shutting all ready for long way which they seem to talk about everything years anyway the last time talking about valves being in short supply that's off to and somebody changes again.

To come through to change their the Telegraph been doing pretty well.

It's an answer digital subscription growth of 40% Charlotte they've been doing pretty well.

Just we haven't met yeah basically for a while now babes focused so much fun subscriptions only over traffic and just print newsstand sales and it's clearly working age in a big target which is to have 1 million paying subscribers and 10 million studies it by the end of 2023 to registered users of people who got signed email newsletter something like that and they're currently over the 144000 so I think they're being pretty confident in that position the whole way through the compliment the group profits and I think search you really good example subscriptions Telegraph subscriber.

I'm not actually I don't know why I'm not I should be up suppose.

I think you know I work for a number of years for news, UK

Alison on printing across broadcasting radio and they just done it right.

You know the times.

You know the times is another success intentions cryptians whether or not it's profitable.

You know that I'm trying to think of an audio equipment to get tortoise would be an online audio equivalent of actually what happens when you just stick to your guns.

It's the same as everything you they concentrate on content you know I know a lot of the film writers they cover film in a way that very few other publications do with the exception of empire and arguably the Sunday Times and it paid off people subscribing it it sounds like such a base element thing to say but you know I'm sure we've all been in meetings with ceo's and editors and all the rest of it were you try and hit them with the contents dick and it's like there's another way no really not another way.

You just have to.

Good stuff to people on a read it's not that tricky that that concept seems to elude a hell of a lot of bears the daily for smart 7 proposition is on your road map an element of subscription be it sort of forced or voluntary.

Yeah, I mean it's difficult not to you know that podcast the heading with you go into with apple and a castuera platform providers of got a great colour subscription to them as well.

It will happen eventually daily news now.

I mean why modern wallpaper daily news is there it's everywhere.

It's omnipresent people would just go even if it was 10 p.m.

Here where I can just just listen to talk to so I'm going into any number of things does matter.

How good we package it, but that's not to say that there isn't an opportunity to expand the brand into stuff like that.

We are short form audio proposition so to get people to expect to pay for it.

What should I will pay for 7 minutes? You know it would have to be 1/7 minutes who knows has Charlotte my subscription a podcast with that can Netflix and Disney plus with Pret subscription and I don't think I want to subscribe to those things.

I'm just getting it for free but living crisis and all that do you think people are going to scale back somebody subscriptions and the success of the press has had do you think they might see the subscribers dropping a little bit? I think that is the risk this year yet, but titles targeting more audiences.

I suppose like the Telegraph x maybe it will be less of a problem then if they were targeting lower demographic audience and not an abc1 audience but then the demographics.

Struggled to build subscription propositions anyway in Times Like These with the cost of living crisis but also with you.

I'm going and all sorts to do the government and although partygate might be technically over there still lots of questions about Boris Johnson and longevity as phase with all of that context ID think that people can they will want to keep a trusted news source I can give her the type of person that has decided to sign up to a telegraph or times or ft or economist subscription anyway.

I think maybe they would have to cut other things first but you know he knows I can be completely wrong on the dinner table.

Is it Disney Plus or is it the Telegraph which one goes Jodie now? What do you want to keep Disney plus the Telegraph chopper so pick me up.

You've just said that that the Telecom conference.

They saying that everything is gonna end up being posh news for posh people is that right there.

Well, it was grains as a possibility which I think does often come up in the subscription question and is a good thing for buses and Street to sort of stay aware of it was raised at a panel with some sort of top Media executives and be chief commercial officer at the FTSE admitted.

It's a feasible out curry but said not a desirable thing if that would happen, but he said it's fees boys.

You'd be subsidised essentially master and subscriptions, but then see the other people on the panel were not so subscription-based is the MOT and they all said no you know we completely disagree with still putting out legitimate Denise that people I could see me without subscriptions.

There's still lots of trusted news out there that will serve the people that can't afford to pay people that was saying that work teacher chief executive Guardian

Chief executive there is saying obviously they've got the donations model said people don't like what they do sort of essentially pay, so that people that can't afford to pay still read it because it doesn't have to go subscription-based.

They're saying this model works to make sure that trusted use isn't only pushing you too posh people celebrate summer with Mamma Mia take a trip on stage in London where it all began featuring that timer songs as ABBA

It's the world's funniest musical Mamma Mia at the Novello Theatre you already know you are we going to the UK's energy challenges equinor is looking at the broader and if you picture from wind power Toyland gas and carbon capture and storage and communities together with our Partners and tomorrow find out more at equinox.co.uk and also a deep dive this week early today.

I spoke to BBC this information German Sardar is a day all about what it's like responding to breaking news events such as the recent Texas shooting.

Yes, I like most editorial team meeting in the morning with you.

The team and editors on GTA V for the day and then we run through the stories of the saying I'm usually the night owl in the team on the person who stays up until 4 in the morning and looks at stories usually the one that will bring up in the states that border Germany should get up early in the morning and look at stories out in Europe and the world as the day and then we gather in the meeting and then we say ok, this is this is something that we've seen for instance.

You know yesterday.

We were saying ok to shooting has happened and being formed online and shared by this politician and this member of Congress and it's false ok and then the obvious question would be wise it falls and how many people are Cygnus do we have any idea widespread example of a good texter shooting so so obviously meant happens that some kind of breaking news on traditional outlets and then what sort of places are starting to jump on this and pulling their own.

Lyrics spin on what they say the benefit from a politically or you know you and I know the internet trolls you know people who just do it for a bit of fun and places on the internet that actually nurture examples images of a trans person going viral on major platforms like Twitter Instagram Facebook on tiktok and the shooter and without actually came from for chance of all time.

It's not a major problem in terms of Culture all sorts of stuff 4chan.

You know some of it is very luxurious and but also very very extreme and very very unsavoury.

a board on which is known as pol pol which stands for politically incorrect give you an idea about what was of topics are discussed as somebody just created this person was the shooter despite the fact that we had screenshots of the shooters Instagram and tiktok and we knew exactly I look like and was there obviously but are police officers and this person suddenly on reddit found themselves facing a torrent of hatred just because they've been misidentified as by somebody was just doing it either because they dislike trans people or they were just thought of trying to troll or the just doing it for the sake of doing it who knows but as I said I just going to say what you do tend to see that is slightly more mainstream, but maybe sort of far-right figures pick that up and move that across to Twitter and white Candace Owens

Think was picking up some of that type of information and then it's sort of gets washed through a load of people doesn't it can do so by somebody major impact or has large following that's it.

That's all that is required doesn't necessarily have to be just that person spreading as long as it's on say Twitter feed on Facebook and one that's it.

You know it's going to be all over the place and we saw it actually it was even tweeted by congressman.

Play the deleted the tweet.

I I actually heard it to the repeated on the Today programme something similar to go and eat it so that's the way it works it starts on a fringe smaller platform.

You not always sometimes it comes directly from influences from politicians that happened as well, but it came from my friends place and then before you knew it.

And of course at the end of it, just adding there's one person is done.

Nothing wrong.

Who is facing a torrent of abuse, so that's the dark side of it in the bud and to to stop the spread by pointing out the inaccuracies and hoping that that stems that stems the flow about what I can account do like your job and released into that we want a free internet with rely on a free internet to do our jobs as journalists and into that has been a wonderful thing in terms of providing they this measure for everyone to share their ideas to draw them outside just around love you know mainstream politics and mainstream news organisations and the job of what turns up on a major platform is a matter for the Tech companies under social media platforms they decide what you know they won and they don't want on the bus.

But yes, there is a hole in the sun star when something like this happens and some innocent person is just checking the online free to find out what's going on in Texas what does done it and they come across this stuff because they're not buy they don't know for Channel they're not gonna put in the effort to go and find the exact thread on a very bad and I'm bored and we put in the effort to go find out so that you know innocent person.

He's just found this information online I can just look at the fact that by the way, this is where it come from and it's false and that person that you're angry I have done nothing wrong and if you're interested in hearing more of our chat including tips on debunking fake news.

Just had to patreon.com media pod patreon subscribers get access to bonus interview material with media podcast get each week plus it's

The making of the shouting facts I met a listener this week, who said he was on the verge of doing a patreon sign up so if you two are on the verge of doing a patreon signup.com media pod right will be back after this Charlotte and Jamie here looking at the media headlines about Russian oligarch, Alexander lebedev, who's quit his role at the Independent Jamie Russian oligarch the not particularly popular at the moment.

Why is he stepped down from the Independent they just can't get a break and then I mean it's it's because he's been placed under economic sanctions bike for in quote quote directly enabling the Russian war in Ukraine is not got any formal role of the Independent anymore, but

As I'm sure I'm not allowed in being the the formality of this the Independent always said that you know he's not had any real input on the business for a while.

You are obviously sun be referred to as lord.

Let the bed now is running things I can see why he's been ostracised and removed.

It's a bit of consolidate similar to the man from Chelsea who had to sell but you just get the feeling that just so you know the researching the run away until it safe to land again is my personal take on all of this Charlotte and the space within each paper claims Alexander has no role, Commercial Road wise in the running of the paper, but it is ownership regardless of all that just a bit concerned estimating by the way that the action company he stepped down for was independent print Ltd but the company that runs the Independent independent digital news and media.

So he would still associated with the body that bought the title, but yeah, I mean it's a sticky question.

I'm not one to judge other than you know they are rationally going to report you know quite close to Peterborough Media prices any nice billionaire Media prices that mean I don't know I can't think of one really mean all media owners have a tangled relationship with governments and governments of the day.

I mean Jamie you work for new school everyone ends up working for Rupert in some way shape or form at some point in your slightly.

Holy moly days.

I'm sure there were lots of tip-offs from from journalist about dodgy dealings by their bosses and proprietors right.

It's the same as it was it's the same as always will be you know nothing nothing changes at all.

I think that's more concerned when George Osborne evening Standard that can send me more than

Being at the proprietor of it and you're having work for news court news UK on and off and Sky when when Rupert was still the owner of Sky for many years.

I've spent the vast majority my professional life probably working for roofer in some way shape or form.

Not that it would have a clue who I am and it's a tricky one.

It's two balancing at the look yourself in the mirror and still go to work everyday.

We just get on with it.

I don't think necessarily that any of them a better than any other really yes, I'm sure they all caught the number 10 quarts all of them as do they when they need Ofcom sorting out.

That's just the way it always has been it's the way it always will be but it's what you do on the shop floor that makes a difference.

I think Media Michael's immune from regulation and anybody who's in power and in number 10.

I didn't really want to take on the press Barons even if they're using.

Letting them they they used to take the publishers are the position and yeah, I mean the newspapers might go to fewer people in print nowadays, but I do think they still have a massive against online and so be influenced might be slightly different to what it used to be but it's still is there and also the newspapers themselves in print even of the wider public is so interested.

I think Whitehall and government and people there and do still really care.

What goes on front pages and stay in the good books definitely just found on this mean Jamie you're in a digital business now.

Do you think the press of lost their influence or Charlotte said they've just called are influenced into different places.

I think they're definitely have lost their infancy compared to the Thatcher era, or in the area of important.

It was to make sure that you have the sun on your side.

You know which way the singing ago and I'm sure it's important to either side of short number 10 care and I'm sure the newspaper prices care.

I genuinely believe that we're turning point in terms of mood and how you know certain people voting age in 5-years time.

I'm not going to give two hoots about what the editor of The Sun things about potential Prime Minister I think that has been to see change over the past 10 years, but as long as we both keep feeding the machine then there's that relationship will never change.

I think politicians will be terrified of getting on the wrong side and proprietors with terrified of getting on the wrong side of legislation the problem that the government has is the speed on the media if they don't understand the Landscape understand the Landscape even less than the newspaper prices for instance.

You only have to look at the privatisation of Channel 4 and all the conversations that Nadine doris's been having in public to show just how little Dave

Basic technology let alone the intricacies of publishing to multiple platforms, it's just it's not something that every Media Baron is scared of is the wondrous world of the media quiz and it's entitled mistakes and make-ups.

I gave you describe three stories where media companies have made public apologies this week.

I'll give you one word from the headline at a time.

Just buzzing when you know the story and your buzzing with your name so Charlotte you will say Charlotte and Jamie you will say Jamie right here we go question number one selling a grassy reveal these words when you know what the story is due buzzing Manchester United it was the tickitape on BBC News the crawling text.

Where someone was was testing the system or the worker was doing something behind the scenes and accidentally put Manchester United rubbish live on here.

Is good I watch the video and song with something like rain everywhere and I quite like the colour of a TeamSpeak scroll maybe that's what they need to stop to Jazz up.

The news channels absolutely Steve Martin LA Story the same thing was the road sign board beyond belief that works like some of these houses and nearly 20-years old anyway.

Go to find phone numbers sharing 150000000 Twitter so this is a news from Twitter us regulators have find the social media firm after it gave advertisers uses contact information for Charlotte is this one the

This week's absolute nightmare email addresses to use the service and then it'll advertisers to target those attfield's without mentioning two uses for they might do that right question number three here with the words Upside Down Season 4 Jamie Jamie Foxx which seems to be Netflix's new trick to keep engagement up.

Are you a Stranger Things fan? I am it's a big family favourite in the house.

I would have been very much looking forward to this probably not as much as Netflix been looking forward to it.

Had a rotten old time is it of late part from better call Saul and bridgerton Stranger things is probably the the last remaining can of champion title they've got on that even that's only got one.

Left after this one doesn't stop for them also Charlotte they've obviously going to turn up their revenue as their subscriber numbers have failed a little going to Crackdown on password sharing to share your Netflix password with anyone well my brother step flicks password, it's like all over again.

I've got others don't worry good alright.

Well that makes a Jamie the winner.

It's a 6-month free subscription Netflix to Jamie and it's Charlotte having a six-year backdate an invoice from Netflix for your consumption of Stranger things and everything else well done.

That's it for the show today.

AJ me.

How can people keep up with what you are talking about this? I can find me on Twitter at Jamie's or you can just search for the smart 7 wherever you get your podcasts lovely and speaking podcast Charlotte you been busy at Tesco's at towers.

There's a new podcast that's been.

What's it about it's called the future of Media explained age in on the way, it's different saying this Weekly News Focus and what's been going on where deliberately taking a slightly longer of you, so I taking you like a theme a week and soul of Sweet It Was by publishing this week.

It's been Ukraine and next week will be to do with the duopoly so I thought of having one interview when sort of a bit of discussion about that into each week, so hopefully be something that people in the industry finds useful as that's the future of Media explain diffuse type that into wherever you get your podcasts absolutely and we'll see you too.

Thanks Matt thank you.

Thanks to the show this week if it's the first time you found us remember that you can of course like the other said subscribe off holiday show in the place where you get all the

Podcasts are the ways to support the show to you can become a patreon scared of patreon.com flash Media pod side up there very inexpensive that you can choose the price that suits you and you still get access to all of the kiddies and it helps us make the show and if you're in the lookout for some software for recording audio and video conversations one that use river FM that's what we use and if you use the code Media pod when you take out of riverside.fm trial we got a baby kick back so if you're looking for software do you go with trout riverside.fm? I'm used to code mediapad with support from that.

He'll it was a rethink audio production.

Celebrate summer with Mamma Mia take a trip down the aisle with this funny feeling it's all around the world and then on stage in London but I may songs as it's the world's funniest musical Mamma Mia at the Novello Theatre you already know you love it.

I never like the analogy of being this comes down and never liked it because I will come home and I will see all my people my people live here.

I moved to New York and when I love my mum.

My people were still here.

My family is here.

So how do you talk about a city like it's disappeared.

My name is Jessica care more intersections Detroit resilience and herself in the heart of the TV show on Apple podcasts Spotify or wherever you find great stories.