Read this: The secrets of Social success

Hello and welcome to the media Show podcast once upon a time if you wanted to be rich and famous.

You'd need to get on old fashioned TV you need to know the right people the channel controllers the agents the commissioners.

You know the sort The Gatekeepers basically.

Well.

I forget all that today with nothing more than a smartphone you can become a megastar if you want proof of the pudding power of online celebrities well at weekend to YouTubers with a beef sold over 15000 tickets for a real life boxing match at Manchester Arena millions of other watching online many on pay-per-view.

Can you think of two stars of the old mediaworld? You could do the same robin day and ludovic Kennedy pets know me neither so today.

We're asking what's the secret to reaching social media mega stardom Louise Pentland has done just that and is in Northampton studio Louise thank you for joining us.

Have you lost track of how many followers you have on line? Thank you for having me.

I haven't lost track but I don't like to be like.

Hi Louise I called you and you can be if you don't have to be humble to tell us about how many followers you have on what describes on YouTube and followers on Facebook and Twitter Twitter I think it's 102 million 2.25 karaoke 5fb around the million Instagram think two and a half million and YouTuber got two channels ones on a million and one son 2.4 million records show retailers roughly how we want if we wanted to do it we can achieve that success give it my best shot to be sexy with a small thing in a second Shona Ghosh Business Insider is also shown are you at the Manchester arena on Saturday night for the showdown between KSI and Logan Paul at was that the weirdest deployment of your chosen career.

I was actually bare the day before I was at a wedding on the Saturday night, but I was there for the press conference in the run out where they have the way and had of the match which as you know you just literally it's the boxes or YouTubers in the

Tesco and standing on a scale and you know their standing in their pants and definitely cup of them had stuff socks down their pants and that's quite weird really weird, so KSI is a British YouTube Star he made his name over the last five years.

I would say just by playing FIFA on YouTube and garnered 19 million subscribers because people found him very entertaining to watch when he's obviously tonsils from money through advertising and he's parlayed that Fame into real-life boxing matches where he takes on other YouTubers some of him and not known for boxing either and so they're taking them onto fights in real life Logan Paul is an American super YouTuber who also has about 19 or 20 million subscribers at you.

May have had his name in the news earlier this year because he famously had to apologise for filming a video in Japan where it seems like he found himself next to a dead body in an area known but you know for your support suicide so incredibly mature and any subsequent apologise for that, but these guys are mega make.

Mega famous will work out why are with your helping Louise's in a second? Thank you show that and what would be on the opposite side of the media world venn diagram to all of that how about pearl and Dean cinema advertising Catherine Jacob is the CEO Catherine can you encapsulate your business in 5 seconds putting fantastic content in front of the right audiences in the best cinemas in the UK that's a very snappy way of doing it here is another version here Wellow producer.

Richard want me to play that but cafe many people when they hear that it would mean a nice warm feeling of nostalgia.

Is it true to say that nostalgia is good for your advertisers in that people are more likely to buy something to see the advert if they've got that warm clothes nostalgia watching over them.

I think it's about whether you put the right with the right content so the ads that you're wrong with The Incredibles going to be completely different to the ones that you run with Bohemian Rhapsody for example.

So it's about the appropriateness of their content and one of.

Things about cinema is that people paid to see people's ants cheers quite remarkable and they will turn up in lots of time and sit down with their friends and have a glass of wine and chat about what they're about to see and social clozapine that cos they plan their visits you know together if you want to work appropriate use of content you come in the right Radio 4 show I can assure you I was it also here is Simon Walker who's the CEO of Marquee TV a new streaming service which wants to be as it cools it the Netflix of art programming Simon are you and your ilk the Enemy of pearl and Dean because you started a business which is all that getting people to stay in the living rooms for longer and not leave the house for somewhere sociable that cinema.

Thank you that intro possibly the different bit of the venn diagram from guys in pants be since I was out but definitely not trying to stop people go out in fact one of the reasons.

We created Mark e.tv.

Is because our research tells us that digital apps actually Drive younger audience.

Choose to engage more in real life events, so you know where the second wave of online apps which are actually wasn't keeping people locked in their bedrooms at home.

Where is it going to be able to go out 75% of our audience will take an online experience and convert that into going to a real life theatre or cultural event and vice versa 75% of people in a theatre will consider looking at something online or the weekend we can all pretend to be friends with in a studio, but I think there is a bit of animosity between you and Catherine trying to call Louise Pendry satistics or Louise did of how many followers she has online she's also crossed over into the world of publishing her second novel Wilde about the girl is out this month the first was a bestseller at Louisa start with the blogging in the videos.

Can you tell us about the Solar stuff? You're putting online which some ready for this is may not know about videos predominantly about motherhood lifestyle sometimes can have light entertainment and also.

The week I put out a weekly vlog which is just following me around my week.

Just having a chit chat to the camera like you would have friend to watch on a Sunday morning and how important are the production values for your videos because lot who thinks he be issued expensive are the videos that you published English of millions of subscribers.

Are they often just filled in your phone.

It's one step up my phone but not a very high step I have a Canon g7x mark II which you can buy on Amazon for about £500 or other retailers many places you can buy this camera about £500 and it is pop a memory card in point and shoot and then I put it into my laptop and edit it myself on my laptop so production quality not very high everything identity V and a TV show with the BBC so I can say it may be impossible impossible celebrities game show and I was like amazed at how many cameras and all the equipment I was like wow.

That's me to shame.

The cost comes in a course which dogs do you think it's so expensive? I'm on the show Louise we all about the business of Media just explaining how you make an income from all of this I actually have many screens.

I don't just have one person that will pay me each month it doesn't quite work like that.

So one of them is the ads that you see on YouTube when little add pops up the Creator will get a cut of that revenue.

It's about pound per thousand years also brands of and work with me because they want to put like I see the lady said they want to put the right content in front of right people.

They know that it's mother's it's women 25 to 35 watching what I do and they want to put their hands in front of them.

So they'll pay for you for that.

I also write books and their best sellers, so have a revenue from my publishing house, but those whatever they're than mainstream the revenue for me how the moment are the rules on how you let your viewers.

They're watching an advert rather than an authentic Louise Pentland video.

They are pretty tight at the Beginning any rules because it's bit of a Pioneer industry in what order starting out but now we have the ISA which is the advertising Standards Agency and they're pretty clear and I love that we have that and that I can be clear with my audience because there's nothing worse than when you make a piece of contents as I just paid to make this is actually like well.

Yes, I was and I've been very clear about that or no.

I wasn't and I think if you have that transparency and you game that trust and you retain that trust you're going to be a successful.

Could you all these reviews lose? I've got to ask how much how much roughly do you earn to me? How much can you make doing the same thing you're doing on YouTube my dad.

Told me it's very unclassy to tell people how much you earned so I won't turn on the radio but you are welcome to say how much do you earn on the radio for you like very much.

So you don't have to show.

That can be lucrative with your books like wild about the girl but I want to get a sense of how many people could actually make a really lucrative living people go into logging thinking I'm going to get rich and famous and if you're going at it that way you're not going to do it.

I make a good salary from it because I've been doing it for 9 years and I think if you started any job anywhere and you worked hard everyday and consistently you would work your way up the ladder to so you start off making nothing and I make nothing for a good 2 or 3 years and then obviously it builds up and there's the likes of KSI and Logan Paul with their like millions of subscribers and all their revenue streams say for sure will be making millions and lose their through thousands of people out there.

Who was you trying to build Chris like this many of them an earlier stage in their financial and editorial Evolution at then you've got to what makes a particular video or a particular personality popular on YouTube on YouTube the ones that people could connect with and

That will resonate with them so for example.

I could put up a whole which would be kind of show you what kind of stuff I bought in the shops at week or I could put up a video like I did last week about my personal mental health experience with PTSD after the birth of my first daughter and that did so much better those videos always will because their emotional and the community that I feel online very engaged they very connective the very emotive and and they want to watch that kind of content I think that that's what YouTube offers that a lot of traditional Media currently doesn't I was given that the thing that is that the think you're kind of Fame makes the exacting makes your kind of Fame different to a conventional TV star you got them much more regular and Direct connection and a personal connection with all this is because I subscribe to you Louise Pentland rather than watching a program a Strictly euro Bake-Off will ever that comes on at certain time definitely more personable connection and it feel.

A lot more like a friendship.

There's no real scripting.

There's nothing particularly glossy about it or they saying that whenever I do traditional Media things like if I do TV or radio magazines my online audience always engage with it and they're so excited about it because they're on this journey to they know that that's something I want to do a want to get more into traditional Media so when I do that so happy about it because they like cheerleaders.

It's it's such a warm community of kind of like having two and a half million best friends or cheering you on its amazing.

Just like a nightmare to me forever birthday birthday.

Do you stay with I said you gonna bring schoenebeck in I'm showing at this Louise's mobile terribly embarrassed ask about salary, but this is Big business now and the likes of Logan Paul and KSI he's YouTube personalities and they've got tens of millions of subscribers their fight was available as pay-per-view this a real world fight this isn't some game show how much rap?

Retired made out of it.

Yeah, so I did some back of the envelope maths the other day and I have very roughly calculator but they are I don't know how much they would have taken away themselves, but that the event would have generated around 8 million lbs, and that's not even including the merchandise.

They might have sold you know the odds against the videos that they would have run on YouTube YouTube in the run-up to the fight that's just from the tickets and from the paper being had a fight with 6 rounds.

I think was it ended in a draw and I don't know how is the viewing experience of compared with fringes watching Wimbledon on BBC One and it would it be a superior quality TVs.

I think so, I think they did prioritise.

Are you know making it feel as though you're very much in the room and obviously don't probably have the same sort of statistics that they had professional commentator something quite famous and come from the boxing world there were lots of real boxing stars from behind the scenes through involved in the production and creation of the event so I think they would have tried to make it feel as professional as possible and in 8 million pounds and Times of Uno

The event making that much money is is comparable to a high-level boxing fight taking place in the UK is rosso that I wasn't getting a bit of stick for the coverage of US Open tennis at the moment, so not all of these technology experiences of life support is being a totally successful sounds like this wrong with YouTube was Louise more more of what's happening on platforms like YouTube as your experience shows that clays spilling out into the real world.

I not online alone is your commercial future and just think about this is advice for some of the students to listen to this shows like the idea of following your career is your commercial future going to move more more towards things that life events and merchandising yes, and no I think for me YouTube will always be the core of what I do.

It's my passion is well.

I love it's what I started doing it sort of based everything around so for me.

I intend to continue with that stream on YouTube but I love publishing I love the books everything I have loved all the TV work at radio work and magazine won't go down so I would really like to branch out and put into that a little bit.

If you'll have me, I would never charged customers before if you would you lose it, what is there a world in which if I want to follow your very moving video sprinters about motherhood or someone I know does there have to pay £5 a month for it? No, I don't think for the kind of YouTube videos I'm making I really would feel comfortable to charge people cos I really am just filming the Marner point and shoot camera and editing them myself.

I think maybe if I wouldn't have enough.

I don't think me and a ring in my pants that would be a good luck, but I can see why they did charge the event because you know it was a lot more professional.

They did have professional production costs to go with it, but for me I think for the type of YouTube videos are making right now.

I don't think I would charge no Louise suppose.

It's ringing me Simon Markey TVs going to offer premium arts programming which we going to get in more detail in a what do you look at the success of people at Louise Pentland as a sign of encouragement with it shows people are willing to pay.

Digital contact me they're not paying for Louise with paint for YouTubers I mean the markets changed and what hasn't happened is that the culture and Arts sector is kept up with it in quite the same way right so monkey TV is about creating a space with the highest quality performances up with 4K with full HD we are super premium cos we're licensing the best creative expressions of Arts ballet Theatre ETC in the world about you 10 years ago when you work at the BBC people said every is gonna be free online a lot of people said that they see now it seems people are willing to pay is like a right and that's good news.

I don't think you could have another thing we could have done marquee.

Don't see me even five years ago because number one People One paying for content and number to the cost of developing the Tech was so high this stuff is now in the cloud and it's very very well relatively straightforward to put together the technology.

What's hard is to create the brand which one is correct the global brand for culture funny you should mention that because Catherine Jacob is as I mentioned the chief executive of pearl and Dean the British ATS in.

Advertising company, I'm catching would you like pearl and Dean to sell advertising on Louise's Youtube channels in other words should pearl and Dean diversify away from cinemas when I think Google would be rallycross suddenly started taking the question is would you like to do it then we do it already, so we're not always in cinema.

We've got a partnership with P&O Cruises so we serve ads in there cinemas on their luxury ships.

Are we work with Luna and cinema and nomad and rooftop so our experience isn't just about cinema.

It's about film so we do it already.

So there's talk about what makes advertising the kind that you sell successfully you give a platform to successful.

Is it true that the kind of advertising that Louise Pentland often does which can include product endorsement by an individual the people feel they got a very intimate relationship with is not far more effective than putting something on at before a film and hoping that it's there's people.

So I I think you're right if it's if I'm advertising men's underpants next to mamma Mia here.

We go again.

I think you could complete right but one of the reasons.

I whip my team are really good at what they do is they say this is right film for this brand and and you can take the experience deeper so for example.

We broke the relationship between M&S and the second Best Exotic Marigold Hotel that was the first stop for then.

I went on and had a relationship with Paddington if you can find the right content because people have contained any put brands next to it.

It works seamlessly you know and people will accept it because they understand that it's part of the value transaction and so I think that the diversification peace France is all around.

It's really great content that's available primarily in cinema, but also in other places.

I mean I think our business is actually complementary to

Simon's business because we do arts content in cinemas, so if you go to The Plaza in Truro you can see miss Julie on you know I think September 7th it isn't the rise of NT Live forgive into a bit Simon in marquee TV and Dan snows history hit which was only a couple weeks ago.

I tried to me to get people to pay for streaming services at 3 Saturday living rooms watching great stuff.

If you're trying to get people out of their living rooms because most of your money comes from bums on seats in cinemas in an accident.

I will be very nice to each other the studio, but there is attention areas near between streaming which is probably done at home and what you are which is filled go out, but it's the same tension that you get with terrestrial television so it's ever dust and so when television starts becoming you know taking more appetising money.

What have you ever on said cinema was going to die global box office has grown by 7% over the last five years you get films like black panther that people talk about you.

Ain't interesting thing for us is what digitisation standards and able assist segment audiences better, so it isn't just that he disick's parents or it's Porky's 43.

You do get with.

Oh my god not not on about what you do.

Get to get a very different experience so you can have the Incredibles in one screen and you know National Theatre in another ok angel port of Poland dinars from local businesses in a hugely important to us because and I'll cinemas like the fact that they are embedded in their communities because that's the heart of where they are because we have people from regional newspapers who come into the media show and say that Facebook and Google of stolen all of their advertising India destroyed the classified ads market basically in local newspapers, which many of which are in big trouble to share that concerned we never rang classified ads our answer always I mean we did you start with famous for the five minutes from this anymore.

It's a beautiful day.

Do you know which will use to colour syndicate?

How much everyone still talks about it's really very real people they were real.

They were really just had a shot of her.

You know the star of India or 10 minutes from here.

You can get your car serviced now assessing that kind of contents really easy we get lots of local businesses using things like Louise's YouTube experience of a point-and-click and making something that's good enough actually to put up on screen socio no catharines talking about the enduring power of advertising and it's worth saying that company we often talk about the show which you love her.

Love of everyone's heard of called Facebook is today launch.

Its own advertising funded IVF Bristol Facebook watch what is it basically has it work? It's basically you go on Facebook and watch telly that starts the concept of it so Facebook watch is a new tab inside the Facebook app, so you open it often if you could watch you would see a bunch of professionally produced shows probably around half an hour long perhaps bit shorter and you can watch anything from comedy to.

Cooking for sports that's what what isn't be the Facebook commission shows from news producers for example.

What are the professional content creators you know and often their celebrities like the marriott's Australia today mate? It's true to say that the hearing what Louise saying looking what Facebook to do with Facebook watch it is becoming very easy the barriers to entry to being a producer and presenter on media a completely collapse in all those expensive cameras and equipment that Louise was talking about platforms that YouTuber Facebook watch completely obliterated until I think about you.

I think what you always.

Do you need to do is have very compelling content and the best is always going to rise to the top so Facebook watch has been live in the US for about a year and I was reading a couple of reviews and part of the issue is that people people are watching at people are switching over to the videos harm and watching stuff on Facebook watch that then maybe hasn't been said of the one or two super compelling shows that are going to rip people away for long periods of time by just be closer to pay for this stuff for now.

It's free and fun.

Buy advertising Facebook takes a cartoon than the rest goes to the Creator unlike marquee TV presenter streaming service every mention has launched a couple of months ago.

I think so so so is that right right? Yeah? This is yet another service that wants a monthly subscription for you.

We had eleven Sports on last week.

We had Dan snows history hit TV not long before because we we do like to keep you updated with the latest services on this show this one is indeed call Marky the tagline is culture On Demand and it wants to be at the Netflix of the odds everyone wants to be the Netflix of and something and it's Simon me asking you a bit about the other person who who owns Marquis always some by the founders and some very very wise seed investors who I am out to one by one no no they literally friends is literally friends and family to have some friends and family who are in the industry and other space in a very rich.

You don't need to be rich to build these things these days and I'll tell me about it.

How long to have it rich.

Do you need to be provided to launch streaming service?

Every week so I was going to get streaming service if I wanted to want launcher as service dedicated to Anna reggae from how much money would have to raise to get many things off the ground you can do these things with the £300000 these days right, but it depends on rights and let you know the back to the point channel is making on Facebook then then vs.

Lot of money and content but they're not solving a problem.

What's the problem that solving by putting free telly on Facebook there is free telly.

You know it's fine.

There's no problem to sort a list from to each other solution the reason you cannot watch high quality ballet drama.

Opera Theatre in a in a safe environment online adamant.

There is no app that does environment what you think they're on Sea places where you want me in for the related if you was alright alright, then.

It's the right you know if your depressed.

He might stick a YouTube channel up, but it will not feature your main performances that would I Sky Arts I mean is there a danger that you could end up just being a poor man's sky not well.

I hope not as I was just that im a little bit in the UK only.

Is no global service I mean what the what's happened in the market as it's polarising now, so you've got Facebook Amazon Netflix the big supermarkets have content and they've one already right.

They've got the audience and they can do pretty much what they like the middle guys might of wherein the BBC Today iPlayer and Co this struggle in the long term because their territory by territory.

They pay by the Old rules and why is the Crown on Netflix not the BBC will BBC can't buy global rights in the way Netflix account and you it's worth saying it's point.

Sorry to trouble you involved in the launch of iPlayer where you can take it back in the day everyone who everyone who were competing claims of invented it, but I had a hand in it, but it what's what's happened at the other end of the spectrum is used in these global niches arrives so super serving and underserved audiences and there a content partners out there if you're Opera House of Barry house or theatre company you tend to be filming your constantly stares, but you don't have to manage right.

See you don't know how to you might stream to cinema with seeing that a little bit that market is opening.

But what doesn't there's no point of that's what I mean by safe environment you're not mistaken on YouTube for free and there isn't really a dancer audience on YouTube who come for you come to YouTube for culture something about half poor friends for being the operative word listeners who are nearing exhaustion with all these subscription services, they got Netflix the one thing I got to pay the BBC licence fee otherwise I could end up getting hurt the old bill coming round they've got to pay the Amazon getting into Sky Sports are going to pay for Hulu maybe YouTube KSI Logan Paul maybe there's a crossover between your older sister.

Is there a danger to Evermore niche offerings end up just annoying people let's hope not I think what happens is that people get to choose what they want rights of the research.

You have that lovely chat for Manpower on a few weeks ago who sang as vod stacking which is online TV having multiple subscriptions in the US now people have three services on average, UK it's 2 in Sweden does more online TV than there is pain.

So people can find what they want if you are passionate about culture and arts and I'm sure the media show audiences we set up a voucher code for Media show listen is if they go to my hair with a lizard outsunny Sherry unavailable Catherine Mercury's aimed aimed at people that you'll be honest head you heard of it before today now, but then they going to happen on holiday.

I don't get out much so now I I love the idea of it.

I like the fact that it's very it's very pure and it's very focused and it's not contributing to the Digital landfill of just more stuff that you could you know spend time with you should be doing something much more worthwhile, or what have you and like the phrase distal lad what you can copy right that show that isn't there a David and components.

This is so I'm just explaining and you got a few big B statz Facebook Netflix but if those guys say we're gonna get really serious about our to get really serious about culture is not a danger that you can wipe out marquee TV so I was nodding at this point or perhaps Simon taping.

A multi-million a multi-billion pound acquisition and the often should Netflix decide to go down due to you up for sale near what happens if if if Netflix gets excited about arts and Culture Amazon and Sky and comcast whoever that ends up like they will be interested in it too but thought you know we're just trying to build the brand for this stuff it starts with video online but actually ticketing loyalty rewards getting people to go to Cinemas to watch things were building a brand is not just an escort that Louise Pentland Simon thank you very much.

Are you coming on black orator US Airways and Qatar Jacob thanks also for coming on Anthony Louise Pentland who is on a bit earlier, but thanks mostly to you guys listening with back at the same time next week as I always say this point, but it's saying you can of course subscribe to this show is a podcast to search online for the media Show podcast and hit that golden button subscribe.

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