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Read this: #85 - Murdoch Joins The Magic Kingdom, British Journalism Awards - The Media Podcast with Olly Mann

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#85 - Murdoch Joins The Magic Kingdom, B…

Hello and welcome to the media podcast I'm only man on today's show as Disney and Fox Drive at night.

What does it all mean for the sky beard and the Murdoch's news prior also on the program BuzzFeed announce big cuts to his UK news operation and Awards season continues as we look at the winners of the British journalism awards plus we answer these questions.

Why is Apple investing audio search technology? How will AI destroy our newsrooms and why after all this time as the media quiz only now decided Two Basic ways around Netflix statistics the answers are all to come on today's Media podcast and joining me today is the creative director of folder Media it's Matt Deegan about this time every year that you put the fear of God into people about young people on YouTube that they've never heard of.

YouTube rewinds has just popped up online at if you haven't seen it.

This is where you just require a lot of money creating a sort of music video mashup that includes lots of famous bloggers and often when it appears people say I don't know any of these people and they pretend that that's a big septuple things to say in my response always if you make Media for people under 30.

Can you cannot name any of these people you are absolutely 100-percent in the wrong and at the end of the videos lots of links to those people in their channels.

No one's ever started to show as my guess is driving me as 100% wrong before but who should I be aware of I don't want you to you and Dan TDM Markiplier Markiplier Markiplier what does he do? You make videos about video games? Why do I need to do is because if you're under 30 TV consumption.

Younger people live TV exemptions in decline there were these people consuming video content of which lyric Gmail or is YouTube and I like these personalities in the same way that we liked TV personalities because that's all that we could consume on-screen meetups use relationships with audiences and we should understand why they're popular because that's the changing nature of what people consume and also it's different form a lot of varied to training as well and your email this week is an investigative reporter and host of all the biggest podcast this year.

It is the tip offs Maeve mcclenaghan.

Hello mate.

I apologise.

I'm losing my voice as I say your name is no discredit the tip-off made the observer's top 10 radio listings of the Year congratulations reminds us of the concept should I say about 6 months ago the idea is that and I'm in investigative journalist.

I have lots of friends that investigative journalist oftenly produces amazing stories, but what I find even more interesting is details.

They tell down the pub of how they got there when they're wig started to slip and I thought they were going to get found out or when they got.

You know completely twist and turn down the wrong path and it all went wrong for a second and then they manage to write it again, so the idea of the tip off is that each episode of digs into a different occasion in them in that kind of cereal wait we kind of go along on the journey with the investors general just the one episode exactly close to return episode arguments.

I would love to do that, but I have a life and a full-time job is well know for now.

It's just that one episode one investigation well done now as we record thanks to the unique way the media podcast is put together there are noises Off that Disney are about to agree a deal to acquire 21st Century Fox from Rupert Murdoch and go and by the time you listen to this you'll know whether that's happened.

Let's assume that it's happened.


What does it mean it's two things isn't there there's Rupert Murdoch is now a seller rather than a buyer and that's quite shift on what he's done for the last 50 years and only of the other side is the Disney they put on quite a clip.

Quiring brands and and assets and this gives them some film studios particularly the 20th Century Fox right now.

We're not sure it will be unlikely that the FOX TV network the sort of analogue TV network and we matching Fox News in fox sport won't go across because it would create competition concerns the Disney but they skipped up pretty much the number 3 media operator in America is certificate acquisition Fox News won't go across because of competition concerns because it kind of awkward is Nemo Disney around the whole bunch of stuff.

That's not exactly a line to Mickey Mouse in the past and really merrimack but Fox News I mean of all the brands.

It's not necessarily toxic friends on your point of view it certainly opinionated horrible deceitful business because you're one of the biggest companies in the world people Twitter Disney own fox, because they would turn it into a more centres network which I think we make it.

Unsuccessful, but I think this complexity because Disney own ABC and whilst ABC doesn't really have a news channel of such.

It's more about the the TV broadcasting affiliates and I think you forgot I keep the zebra crossing Philips I might as well.

Keep the cash cow witches witches Fox News why would Murdoch want to sell off the bit that's worth money and keep the news bit which varies directly as had problems is it just cos he's a newsman is what people have said isn't it for decades what he cares about is print and what's happening with intact as the angles that he's going for but yet certainly an interesting one perhaps.

It's just that it's a particularly profitable time.

I'm using the Challenge for all those super large media companies is that transition from broadcast to do on demand in Netflix success Amazon Prime 6s the money that's going to it for most operators Disney themselves as to the going to poo.

All the material off of Netflix 2018 2019 to launch her own streaming service or chicken a relaunch disneylife with does exist at the moment.

That's a really been 6ss oracle battery again the other Suzuki flakes if they're building out and Netflix killer having access to make a man and The Simpsons and although the term electrical stuff all the great advertised energy gives them even more content and actually if you're if you are Netflix that's potentially another chunk of content you can't have access to get that's why I make sense for Disney what does make sense for basically there's about why does it make sense for Rupert Murdoch because that's the biggest surprises nothing no we do a prediction special ever year was ever said this is the remote ux gonna sell everything but is that realisation that it is difficult to compete in that market the movie business has been quite a flat performer profit wise for them.

So you know what keeps.

He does know when does do very well which is the new send based in the musical side and in what is left with 21st Century Fox what happens does it go into music or or is it sort of son of 21st Century Fox because actually both those assets are starting to be more similar is it still called new scorers that goes in there is news UK and it was the news confusing.

You score is the global frightening parent of the Australian dollar news news, UK think it does mean here in the UK for News UK if you work for the sign of the Times what does it mean for you then x 9 hours Parliament thinking about this guy beard and and all of this kind of area of this kind of monopolization the Murdoch press has had for such a long time.

I don't know that this will go anyway to actually addressing that hoodie UK because as we said.

It's you know.

It's a kind of siphoning off of elements offer that don't really correspond to the news element.

So I'm not sure it's going to actually impact mini Shard the guys at work over there in this.

When in the time from things but it's only going to be an interesting x in terms of TV news coverage over here.

I think what the Sky deal is much more likely to go through I think with Disney is the parent company and actually eat if your 20th Century Fox it's like there is still a bit of risk around the sky beard and reputational impact.

It's another packs reason why you might sell it on the other leave it.

There is a Disney own sky would they carry on with Sky News say yes can use always been honest making the murdochs like that.

Exist is been good for Sky to have Sky News but as part of a wider Disney corp.

They don't need that reputational valued so much over to happen to the it would be really interesting to see the reaction in the UK media as well, because the very people who are top something Leanne timo dog would be the people who would be up in Arms is Sky News shutdown doesn't make any money let's stick with their Britain and Fleet Street Gathering 4B press Gazette British journalism awards mate.

If you were there a bit more than that congratulations are in order one and awards.

What football team did so we won the innovation award which was a cool answer when I went to be alright investigative journalism and we have a project.

Hope you're a local which film about energizing and supporting and facilitating local journalists across the country.

Who is Amy so yeah, we have 450 members in our network and what it means in past year.

We've produced over 100 stories with them and essentially it's at local journalists are really hard pressed time and resource wise they don't often have the time to do the can extra fiddly heavy lifting data elements of an investigation or putting on pieces together so we do elements of the investigative project and Anne Marie partner up with them so that they can tell their story in their local area, so we just did a big project about funding for domestic violence refuges all across the UK when we pulled in all these data.

We did a kind of survey and then the local journalist weibel to say what's happening Yorkshire what's happening in Norwich so it is kind of new collaborative way of working trying to work a longer kind of ICI JD international console.

CMS affect agility do the Panama papers and paradise papers the kind of model of if we all work together in the same thing the sum of our parts is much bigger than us individually trying to Scoop each other industry.

Well done who else with the big winners in the night and also the devastating because it's just hard to do story after hard to talk dirty to me that people have covered it been absolutely heartbreaking this year so awkward thing isn't are you serious a radio based of wood stone you as well matter where people are smiling for a photo and it's because of grenfell forever terrorist attacks.

Is there a little bit confusing isn't it amazing journalist recognise their Channel 4 programme on Syria's disappeared 1 best investigation BuzzFeed one for the Business Award for their explosive RBS and they're selling off and stripping off of small businesses Nick Ferrari won best journalist of the year.

Laura kuenssberg one last year and I guess he's a broadcast journalist who really but the Ferrari is a radio channel is basically.

It's a radio presenter.

Are you surprised mate? I've had another good strong year that shows done very well.

He has a newspaper background and without knowing too much about the Awards because there's lot of newspaper journalist who are judging that category perhaps it would make more sense the sum of their familiar with doing a great job without to do well done, but it was on the basis in their citation that is interview with Diane Abbott we had a little moment around her fingers was the moment of the election.

Do you think if you look back across the last year and journalism that is the best example of journalism 24 mean the moment really just how hard is it to trip up by another on a bad day like this work was required.

Japanese going to what I mean Piers Morgan also tripped up Diane Abbott on TV about morning remember watching it.

I felt this year cos I have been to the awards previously as it felt like this year.

There was a kind of widening off of what they were looking at so there's a podcast in the innovation award cutting-edge knew there was radio and there's always been TV and it but it felt like maybe there was a concerted shift away from the kind of old school.

There's only one form of best journalist in that have to be in investigation it has to be the Sunday Times insight team you know there's definitely scope for recognising other photojournalism.

I was surprised as well to see you keep his dalliances with prostitutes in Edgware being the scope of the year.

I mean that was something but only when the story came out me thinking Christ no one expected that but at the same time a lot of questions for raised about whether that should have been front page news weather is an intrusion of his privacy has she had a fight quite hard to justify public interest because of his response.

Still teasing kind of cracking down on face and the kind of laws around it, but yeah it felt like those had to be kind of laid out to explain why just that was public interest and not just salacious cut her hair match BuzzFeed as well amongst the winners and it's been a bit of a metered atmosphere and then using this week because they've announced almost a third of their UK staff are facing the Chop what do we make it this yeah? It's pretty devastating I think you know how freelancers to bid for BuzzFeed in the past but also and I just for the UK media seen I think they've been doing some amazing stuff, but don't Restorations team and then news coverage and to be honest they hire they have a much more diverse Newsroom I think than most other publication turn the UK to the idea that some of those younger generous from a wider range of backgrounds and we used to might now find themselves looking for workers is pretty devastating but it's happening now because ultimately there a business and there's rumours that they're trying to sell in there at the moment as well.

You know if this is the British

Isn't making the money it should that's a decision that again.

I think it's a standard way that a lot of Internet startups work in that they have lots of cash coming in in funding rounds.

Let's grow grow grow grow grow.

You don't have to literally worry so much about exactly which bit too doing well and which was not doing well, because there's lots of gambles along the way they're getting to a point now where the pub in not going to have additional funding Grant had a lot of radiance O2 get the next evaluation at a higher level you need to raise a large amount of money which is difficult to do so what you do.

Look at that you can I go back to looking at the business have a number of top of my head, but the UK has seen strong advertising growth, but they cost of going slightly faster peretti said the other day that the bread it was really double down on the train.

I think we've had to see your face saying to leave BuzzFeed being seen to see which areas that is and what kind of cat well, this is it that mean we're moving to?

If you like serious journalism that BuzzFeed have unquestionably managed to reposition themselves with was that something that uses ever really wanted.

I mean I used to go to BuzzFeed for the for the listicles and then things you only know if you want to Warwick university in 2009 that stuff to get shared on Facebook and it's a bit very encouraging an interesting with they're investing in original British journalism, but I didn't send that that's what my friends are showing that stuff on Facebook wanted to see the same page as my daily news you know that's why I go to look what's going on overnight but from what I hear.

You know this 5000 + word article.

They did he's really long depth in deep dive people do read and you know this this statistic that I don't know them but for my hair from journalist at is that they do not have actually quite high attrition rates of both sharing and people actually reading to the end of the articles, so I might be that we kind of underestimated this youth market that actually maybe they do want deep dive world written complex stories as well as a listicles and the cat gifts.

See also WhatsApp since thing is it's a relatively smaller new Steam and the article and stories that they cover are interesting investigative different stories and not trying to fill space with rewriting something you get on pie because actually the equivalent of that is the listicles which some is some of it is written by users of the sites as well as some of the team that so probably They're gonna Bang for buck hit rate for the journalist.

They've got its perhaps perhaps higher than you get generally across lots of newspapers or was it just naively built on the assumption that advertising revenue was going to go out, but it isn't you going down.

Everyone's rejecting me and the next year internet revenue in front of their advertisers going to go down.


I think not actually that I think it's the percentage of Facebook and Google take as dispatched rising revenue has grown faster than the market as a whole and I think all night publishers assume that it would be growing and the percentage that could get would at least they the same and that's not.

Case and so there is definitely Shakedown that there isn't the money available that the other big is the the pivot to video meme of that's actually where the high-value CPM stuff is has started to fall apart of these people realised guess what videos really hard to do and again a lot of that money is going in to YouTube and Facebook which is running out their own you video product this year.

It is very difficult to get hold of this hole is revenue Facebook themselves that I think that 50 million quid into Facebook live video and and sort of a forward funding news organisations to make video for their platforms.

That's just the just put all that money so yeah, there's lots of military threat setting to both old and new web media platforms that you were talking about the opening of the show people who watch game is online playing video games and talking about it matter entertainment does Bosley that she seemed like an old establishment name I think a lot of the media question for younger audiences is the traditional one of we've always had witches.

Is that something my mum Reed till my mum listens to my Mum watches, but it was the people who grew up with it in their early twenties.

It's starting is restarting to become that but I did but she does have is excellent ability on social to promote what they do and they have great ideas that cut through and that will cut through to think any audience with their continued doing that well Angela Gibson as well from the Guardian did do well.

Didn't she in hand picking them young British journalist who have made a name for themselves clearly.

I'm gonna go on to other things if they're leaving BuzzFeed only I think it does now.

I think of Jim Waterson on Twitter Isaac convert James Bulger Louise Ridley regular contributors to the media podcast of course changes just left.

I mean you know she did to Halliwell their fantastic lgbtq reporter having somebody just looking at that area is completely revolutionary and away but you know just shows those kind of thinking outside of the box there and ways that they kind of pushchairs stories out.

Through that happened through Snapchat and other things like that you know that they are reaching audiences that others aunt's who knows what would replace that.

I guess you're doing at the moment.

You'll find out if there's an ad inserted now.

If not we'll be back talking in a few seconds this episode of the media podcast was recorded at run VT in the heart of Soho run VT has 15 offline and 2 online sweet as well as a spectacular baselight grading Theatre to go alongside this year diving sweet and voice-over Booth but what can I watch that run VT of been working on recently well, how about the Sky Arts dog passions with conductor Andrea colombini discussing his Love of Puccini it's available to watch now on demand edit your next show at runvt go to run now.

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Come to learn Morse BBC sounds isn't in the 24th century.

We don't have animals Birds insects or trees.

Did you do Forest 404 a brand new drama podcast starring pearl Mackie to listen to Forest 404 first download the free BBC Sounds app? Don't doesn't using breathe now that are still with me Apple have been on an audio spending spree this past month or so pick you up a couple of interesting companies may tell us which one's yes.

I just bought Shazam seemingly for about 400 million dollars good news for this is an seem to happen at your amazing Nicole Scherzinger it's amazing is that they forget a long time is Shazam to thinks of early noughties obviously what's Shazam does is allow people to work out what songs are played and then model of change it to start with Will Remember darling to 580 down the middle of your phone and then hold it up to a speaker an early adopter.

I never sleep they really hurts to cough.

When did you get the message to get a text message back saying she was wow early when gracenote was like a serious competitor to say accessing the gracenote cddb database that well, then the app that was really its transformative measure where people were then paying 30p ago to get that text message the model became an affiliate revenue to buy those songs often through through apple and so what's that that transition now.

There's some news this week.

They look like apple have a sunset plan for a pay for downloads in iTunes and I'll be out by 2019 all that massive speedy to climb and where they can make money is rvc.

Apple music and subjection Spotify still doing much better job and apple music is it just in case I'm someone who am a Spotify user I stream everything on Spotify don't like apple music is a platform.

So the only time I spend money with music on Apple is when I buy stuff cause I want to keep it and ID rather buy from Apple and Amazon are they killing off my revenue at they are the ones that Rises like she is the train onboard more people to apple music and it being stink will they shutter Shazam normally when they're quiet these companies.

They sort of get shattered and then they reappear as a little function in something.

I think she's enough of the brand.

It'll probably stick around but probably more tightly integrated apple music that was about the other brands the other one they've bought that no one really knows about probably only people like you used to text Shazam this search engine that they required for me.

It's hope school pop-up archive yes and then what I hope.

It means is that there's more interested with in Apple for podcasts Yardley apple is the place the most people get the podcast from has the biggest market share has incredibly small team.

You know was all your handful of people globally work on on apples podcast anything.

I love them all yes and especially when they put people in new notable on the chart.

There has me a lot of innovation around the podcast products from Apple from anybody else and acquiring a search engine that can listen to podcast turn it to see a text to speech to text to make that searchable and things like this podcast more discoverable.

Hopefully is going to be a good day.

So that's you think what they going to be using this technology for you.

Think is going to help them Finesse recommendation.

I would have thought you like this American Life episode about autism he wrote another shows weekend in autism or just search search for farming.

Yeah, you'll pick up podcast the mentioned farming in the title and when you talk to podcast as they took a lot about you know the descriptions of podcast and front loading it with keywords all that kind of stuff.

Where is actually what you want to do as you want to search the content of those podcast to find out something.

That's a bit might tell me every Picasso talks about Theresa May this week or the brexit Rebels or whatever actually an audio search engine.

That's catalogue within them is this what you want to lose you Samantha Nairobi a Christmas party last night which is what I say.

Address and one of the topics of conversation when I get here when anyone was saying because it was shouting at each other's ears and ironically terrible room for acoustics.

What about podcast recommendation this issue is Nina apple haven't really attractive but isn't a place really where you can go and discover new shows there's only new and noteworthy and asking your mates on Twitter it's really wicked yeah, and it's quite a shame because then I think you'll end up getting siloed into just listening to the same ones you know I occasionally find a new one and get quite angry that I hadn't been told about it a year ago because I now have backlogs amazing shows and yeah it definitely at the minute still feels like for all of the really incredible innovative work been done and podcast we haven't quite crack that how to tell the wider world about it you get your boogers out there parking on great shows like House of course.

I won't ask if they can have their own followers and people interested in their work they have platform.

You know what you did show about the Manchester Evening News investigation so then people that are interested in that might then come back and listen, so that's the kind of natural bubbling up.

I guess but in terms of kind of hardcore promotion.

That's one that I've yet to crack your put sometime partner in crime James cridland, Matt I thought we won't really interesting blog this week about whether radio providers an audio providers should perhaps consider whether they're too readily opting into TuneIn at TuneIn being the kind of big internet streaming provider of radio streams because of Alexa and Google home and all those things because when you say play me the media podcast it tries to find you by default in June in and like the Facebook and Google thing is one company that everyone's bring all their exams that bass guitar tuning stands between me and my listeners.

You know it isn't it is a Middleman and they can chase the model of which they just done you a tuna historically was basically a radio streaming search engine but what are they doing out there trying to sell her a monthly subscription package and they the put together some

Content particular and sports and like do I want to be only are on a chilled radio station called fun kids do I want to be an add-on to a American driven sports subscription service with a entirely pivot away what happened and I know I'd look at our numbers about 20% of our internet out as a deliver to retuning if that disappeared tomorrow.

Chunk of them would find us another way, but some would someone disappear.

I did you go into more devices.

Who is the default that gets to your Media source be a TV wire Radio 1 aurora podcast 1 tuning is 1-m.

Rest of the Seas Google and again.

Hell is it a line with what they want to achieve on and what they wanted to do.

I think when I've talked to people who have relationships with Amazon around Alexa and Google around Google home.

They haven't got a clue how to cope with invocations which is saying you know play me fun kids and who should own there and I can now basically register fun kids and get that first one.

There's one in America in will that be geo fenced Google don't even allow you to create the equivalent of Amazon Alexa skills at the moment and unless you're a baked in partner sofa TuneIn on Google home.

You can't even at the moment stream radio so I can build anything that stream fun kids I have to have to use TuneIn then you talk to Google at this and they're like it's new we haven't really thought about it.


There is a this is very much cock up rather than conspiracy, but these are going to bed if you want to do something about it.

You have to pay quite a lot of money at the minute.

Write your own web developer.

Will you need to pay another little man.

You know? It's £500 make sure we're on yeah absolutely of skill and it's a lot for a podcast at 2, but it's not the world's most complicated things to do but it's still another platform.

You got your mobile app or I am Google how are you gonna do Alexa and whatever else Sonos whatever else comes along the line I mean Sonos of launched with Alexa in some of the newer devices but most of the audio.

Dreaming doesn't work through it because I rushed out the door.

It's like you sell speakers like the other audio skills should probably work and then I would we we will we will get there I will get there and I think we're a lot of their the speaker and with very much the early.

It's like the early days of the internet with your days.

That's all.

We need an app.

Why does Evan else's got one off.

I needed website and they get domain name sorted out.

I think we'd sort of dropping to a bit of that the good thing of course on Google home or Alexa any deliveries to the evil TuneIn you can just go Alexa play Fun kids and it will activate the listening out of their first time discussing a project with the press association with trialling with AI and they've reached an important milestone this week right.

They've brought out some of their first stories using this new system which

Pure I forget the term for it, but it's kind of computer written articles where they have taken the dog robots writing articles basically and it has some great Black Mirror episode was happening.

It's hard.

Not to get my natural inclination is to get a bit panicked as a journalist, but yeah, there's some really interesting potential.

I think trying to look on the positive sides of this kind of computational modelling of using AI or or computers to do some of the heavy lifting of the country slicing and dicing of data so the stories I've seen that were put out press Gazette today good article about them looked at a data set on whether parents that were married or won't married were having more children in different areas and it seems like what system did was kind of take a big dataset cut it up work out whether your area was more or less than the national average and Men could kind of write you a pretty basic story based just on that data, which is interesting but

I don't know if that is journalism completely because for me reading those stories what I wanted to know was well.

Why what's happened in this area that different to that area? Is there something going on with the Education models or the local religious groups are the demographics that could explain some of this so I think just at the minute.

It seems to be able to slice data.

That's great, but is that journalism is it reliable I mean because in the world of fake news.

You know if a computer just scans 1000 new sites and includes a series of facts.

They may not actually be faxed because it's not prioritising the Guardian Telegraph over some bloke in a bedroom in Russia itself sometimes can tell you a story that isn't actually real so it might be there a big shock that there aren't farms all over Soho do you know that's actually a human with no that's not that's scandalous comparing this Norfolk but a computer might not know that so they might produce.

Story that says what's going on with London farms in central London so yeah, does human Element I think it's still always going to have a place that's not to say that there isn't stuff that you can do with bots and with Gathering updating and using computational methods to help your journalism, but I think that's just one stage and I guess consent is also that specially for the local gender switch this the Uno project is meant to help potentially do local journalism project that time and Resources is there if you spend all your money or you take this copy to that mean.

You don't get a reporter doing that do not employ somebody and then who goes to the council meetings and who goes to tonight's budgeting developments a human needs to do you looking into using your do you say I hope you program radio stations research you lots of stations.

Very research driven.

Some of it's slightly algorithmic.

So you can you can look at the pop cycle for a record so and it's so Discovery phase and then familiarity and favour and then when it burns.

And you can do elements we predict that and Robbie Williams record oral, Ed Sheeran record will tend to follow a similar pattern and potentially that you could probably use AI to to be better at predicting some of that then humans are and possibly and suggesting you know this is the record you should start the hour with because more of Alice's like it when you can buy it with data.

So things like app usage data when people start listening doesn't really mean anything as Siri because there's a million reasons why she started listening.

Why they stopped all ways, which channel can give you quite a lot of information and I know that for the radio player guys are UK radio player which powers quite a lot of UK radio.

Have a lot of Analytics built in that contract that that data and food groups have a number of radio stations on it.

They can start to see such see what happens right.

I want to talk to you about something that I know caught your eye this week from the Netflix technology blog guess.

I was reading this on the way on the train and it was fascinating but quieter.

Deep dive into our algorithms work to the boy cries.

Reading halfway through and read about 1000 words for summarise it for as we all know the Netflix can you get algorithms and telling us what we should be watching based on what we watch previously and what people like us watch but they've gone a step further by delivering different thumbnails of the images that you see on Netflix based on the kind of things you like so if they think you'll like assertively think you'll like Good Will Hunting but that I look at I get this the standard image which is the two of them together that we proceed on The Million DVD cases over the use of an yes that might not be the best way to get me to watch it because out my like Maton mini.

Yes, if I like romantic comedies.

I might like Maton Mini on that day if I like Robin Williams and might like to see him on it, so yes, they've started iterating multiple versions folder thumbnails, and then Ab testing them against all the rest of their rules to get you more likely to click through the right main reason.

I said to retweet it out was God

Other parts of the industry also behind lemon.

Got our regular prediction algorithms working let alone a b z testing thumbnails to to get people to take that extra click, but it just shows the power of the data loss of the dataset you Netflix have an amazing dataset of all this consumption of all of the all of their subscribers and they're trying to do one thing really well, which is to get you to watch more things I hadn't the more consumption you get on Netflix the more likely you'll keep subscribe to it, but other media outlets could learn from this good mate.

So just like heaven online newspaper for example take the time it might be that I like Matthew Parris is it going there so the picture should pay Matthew Parris it might be that im interested in Theresa May as a subject that the picture should be able Theresa May or it might be far more likely to bomb with a satirical view.

So they should put the cartoon absolutely and I think there's always me Alan little elements of that I know the iPlayer they been looking strong Leah how images of Performing and then can iterate images for everyone just coming.

Based on the data that that they have been part of the difficulty with there being so much content actually is that I don't come across things that I would like because of how it's been described and I've see the more efficient people have the virtual bacon to an encouraging me to consume that another version of my previous Lake news question for you without getting too philosophical.

Does it actually changed the way that we encounter heart because if it'll personalised it's not a real reflection of what the makers of that.

She wanted is to see necessarily or even what we would personally get from here.

It's a computer guessing second guessing what we might like which might run under deliver like if you're watching Good wanting because Robin Williams is in it you might be disappointed because they're really mean that you know your taste of the same and I don't know the something in me that that gets to the idea of that kind of being manipulated down a certain path.

I already feel like on Netflix sometimes.

Patronized by the shows at least you know you like shows with strong female lead well.

Yeah, but you know there's elements that I would like and look for so there's a danger that you don't get out personalised battle beat by the way because I I get strong female lead as well that I was assume that wasn't a personalised thing everything had a strong puppet shows featuring three straight white men like would that be problematic there is a danger that then you only ever watch things that you get pushed to watch rather than looking for something completely new then you know the move away from TV I think and newspapers to online consumption of both news and TV shows is that you end up just watching the same thing.

I don't personally when I read the newspaper.

I will read articles that I would never clicked on online and it's the same thing if I was watching.

Indesit had it on background.

I would see things that I wouldn't see if I only ever you know we're seeking out the same old thing comes up to do something to challenge you to do something ok.

I haven't seen something French for months.

What's that because it's friends not because he's got someone in it looks a bit like someone who was in the film ISO Mackenzie is back Max yes the founder of talkSPORT is launching two new speech radio stations for London that you're familiar with this idea on team at PSY what number 1 Kelvin loves radio Kelvin used to own took the company then talk radio talkSPORT he turns a radio in to talkSPORT and he loves we love that business and he made the decent chunk of it when he sold it to TV and over the last few years, there's been a few rumblings of him wanting to come and get back in I think we've reached the point now where you are particularly DAB penetration is strong and

What is even stronger his lunch in eustachian speech station the sports station is what's being said? I think it is speech radio station is Hard 5 Live ready for do a great job LBC is spent a lot of money and work really hard and thought of you to take to get to where they have recently and actually she's a little bit niche niche shouldn't speak to you know it's really a politics radio station fundamental h&t radio is a new entrant been and been around 18 months is Finding difficult to find its feet Square Court of many listeners.

I think they're probably like double that talkSPORT as I'm well up to about 3 million talkSPORT 2 which was going to get 80 months ago has done alright with such of spillover rates from from the main talkSPORT right.

There is a gap sport as I think there is a good opportunity for youth sport radio station is not going to do that well.

What's interesting? I don't know if it is sun actually will be involved but Ashley round.

I think it was good outfits ever.

Which was there a YouTube can a multi-channel network can say the same thing that it would perhaps be a surprise if he went and did a little research about this is also being simulcast on medium wave isn't it was bought variant any sort of thing well, if the business model is based on the arrival to talkSPORT on medium wave.

It's quite hard to be a youth brand.

Isn't it? But if people who consume sport consume it on a M45 live and talkSPORT putting another Sports station on there is not a dreadful idea if you can do it really cheaply and for awareness driving for people who do flick around to find out premiership football matches on 5 Live is on Talksport these Maps not a terrible idea, but they useful support service.

I think would be really interesting more like it a model lorries coming out by burlesque end of things but that would take real effort and real money a big pile of cash to do well.

It's doing some of the other day of every sale, would you go and work at Kelvin Mackenzie speech radio stations?

Show me the top of my list of things to do but I have the money was spent on say the visualization end and the distal end of the online ends in creating that has a interesting multi-platform thing potentially allow the people to do it perhaps the Jurys out, but multi-platform LBC notably in the last few months and started doing podcast Richard Suchet does his new show for the million-dollar Jackie Smith ever show all the stuff they used to be paid for is now free so you can think well.

Is it possible to launch a talk station? That is just a station that isn't about you know online and On Demand this thing as well.

Yeah, quite quickly and might moth into that because that does seem to be the way that everybody's going and consuming things more and more especially if you know sports.

I think it is one thing that poverty people listen to live near need to be there listening to live but the kind of other elements of it the kind of deeper dives into the background of things they they work so well and podcast it it might well, be that moves towards someone with no one seems to want to listen.

Into the recording of Fred from Dewsbury calling up about brexit 2 days ago.

They want to listen to a special so there's not a live radio, show is there is she there isn't there with converting your brand candlelight radio station on demand properties do different things.

What's the core skills course killer storytelling and how you do it and the techniques and the kinds of things with that callers or investigative staff or even strong personalities having an argument which is SoundCloud podcast and it also has someone other markets, so if you look at the Maracana podcasting.

What's them? Really well as the source of this American Life structures documentary and the retus time Wellesley doesn't exist on Broadcast radio, where is here? We haven't really seen a huge amount of that because we've got a really strong documentary history with with the BBC actually if I go and pick a great idea to Radio 4 I get to of Grandpa off an hour and and do it that way now.

What hasn't worked around America is 3 p.

Call in a room talking about a topic because they have that on Broadcast radio, where's we don't so what are we doing it to people talk about the topic they sorts of shows do better in podcasting here in the UK so I think there is a bit of form competition what the right content is and adapting what you do to to fill that need and also that platform ok well talking about Philippines it is time for the media quiz this week is entitled Netflix and ill behaviour the on-demand video companies giving us a tantalizing glimpse into the data.

They hold on that uses what I want you to do is fill in the blanks in the tweets Romero facial account this week is best of three does it with your name so maybe we'll say and that you will say that's the winner gets a subscription to Hulu the loser tries to find original content on here is official to eat number 1 to the 53 people who've watched black every day for the past 18 days to hurt you.

prince Louis have never seen but maybe I should now if every was watching it from the synopsis when a reporter goes undercover as a tutor to get the inside scoop on a playboy prince this as well up your face on Netflix in recommending this to you, but will she be able to keep up her Lie by Meghan Markle Netflix to Netflix in the UK as blank 357 times today in 2017 BC icasp animated thing with Jerry Seinfeld

Here is the final Netflix to eat all that she is not the messages from Spotify but they've also been spying on us and sharing your data to humiliate us the person who put 48 blank songs on there.

I love gingers playlist mats.

Yeah, cos obvious Ed Sheeran yes, it is Ed Sheeran but not the last night that means you are the winner congratulations.

That's it for her show today my thanks to Maeve and Tim at you can catch up with our previous episode and get new ones as soon as they're released by subscribing for free on our website the media podcast.

Can't remember you can give the gift of life this Christmas by taking out a voluntary subscription.

Just a fiver a month can keep us going in 2018 head TV media podcast opcom / donate and please give generously I've been all around the producer Matt Hill the media podcast is 8 PPM production till next time.

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