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Read this: #40 - David Schneider: making brands tweet good - The Media Podcast with Olly Mann

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#40 - David Schneider: making brands twe…

Hello and welcome to the media podcast I'm allium on today's show it's official BBC3 will move online in February what does this with additional cuts to sport and entertainment mean the BBC will look like from 2016.

How can brands crack Twitter I'll ask Tony as himself comedian, David Schneider and his colleague David Levine co-founders of social media writers that lot plus we discuss the sun's pulling problem the end of FHM and the media quiz Dons it wig and judges the news from the library course that's all to come on today's Media podcast and joining me to enliven this rather somber Friday afternoon at the hospital club is journalist and broadcaster Tom latchem.

Hello Tom hello welcome to the show there's a reason why I'm doing that why you're saying hello in that way and Georgia Lionel Richie Fan Club close close, are we Citadel it is Adele have you ok?

Tom I suspect guess that I was about to ask him tell me what have you been up to this week to it? So I guess the answer is something to do with the Dell well Ollie I've been rooting around in Adele's old loft.

You can take the journalist out of the tabloid.

Yes, I did I went back to her the home in which she was born this week.

Give him a tenner.

Obviously her the record.

I couldn't success fastest selling record in history and I went rooting around in her loft and I find quite a lot of her old stuff.

I got to say so keep your eyes out eyes peeled for us a story this weekend.

Hopefully on it things got worse a pre exclusive Thunderbirds card.

You know which you get given with the measurements of that sort of stuff.

I find out first tricycle.

I find a picture to draw an overt the Horseshoes yeah, so yeah quite quite that I was only expecting just get photos of inside of a pokey little old flat bottom live there some stuff still in the loft, so I went well, let's get out there, then this is good old fashioned morally dubious tabloid.

Cannabis saving it and maybe I'll be kept for posterity by museum who knows maybe I'm giving something back.

Have you got photos of some of it on your phone? I don't actually missed and joining time is the news editor of broadcast magazine who doesn't do too much digging around in people's laughs compared with no maybe Michael grades.

Old house also Jake kanter.

You are the hosts of broadcast podcast talking TV which way the media podcast strongly recommend with sisters really sisters.

So what have you been up to this week? I've been very busy on the BBC Three stuff, which I'm sure you'll come aunty.

I was amused by the evening Standard when I was covering its own Theatre Awards there were three separate pictures of yevgeniy leopard ever in the paper III of which was human once it was him spread-eagled lying in front of the winners and I couldn't decide whether that was him.

Just being blindly narcissistic or the picture editors were having a bit of a joke.

I'm gonna spend that kind of money on a newspaper then I imagine the lease is that we are going to start this week with the news that BBC3 is moving online in a way.

I'm grateful.

So it means we don't have to talk about it again, because there's been a lot of speculation of it's finally been confirmed by the BBC Trust we're gonna lose the do you still call it a terrestrial transmission when it's on digital.

I don't know but it's going to come off Freeview anyway in February but before then.

There's this period of transition Jake what does that mean? How's that going to work? So it will start the process of building up.

Its online presence in January that will continue throughout February and the idea was a channel will close write the very end of February and so you have an online-only proposition from March but you get the channel when you turn it on in February or do you know they're saying now? They'll keep it open as a sore promotional window quite what I will look like I don't know lots of trousers from iron content.

What's the messages saying here? We we don't live here anymore.

We're in this big beautiful world Twickenham you online services don't get the opportunity to have a free BBC channel pumped into someone's home with an advert on it.

I was wondering Jake is the BBC expecting young people's services are aiming this.

That's what they're going off offers a range of the younger generation watch anything online expecting these young people to actually go online and watch the stuff.

They done the research and spend a lot of research into it and they think it's going to be difficult of first of the viewers access BBC only three BBC3 80% of those people will be lost because of the online transition those are the very kind of people that have BBC should be trying to hold onto right tone and then of course there's a dangerous if they don't end up watching that content online but then that will be axed somewhere down the line to and so then you've got you know we're already going to be losing a lot of great programming for your younger people that wouldn't exist if BBC3 weren't there and then losing all together potentially.

Life if it doesn't work possibly there's no doubt the BBC Three Faces Long walk across the minefield.

That is the internet which is littered with digital projects have failed, but people will get around BBC3 in the industry.

There will be efforts to make this work and people will support it.

I mean I know it has its detractors, but I think we've got to get on with it and it is still going to be one of the best outlets in the UK for content for young people the thing I wanted to point out in all of this and it gets a bit masked in the discussion about should it move online shouldn't it BBC3 as fundamentally had its budget cut in half and that is not a good thing whichever way you spend it and that's nothing to do with actually coming off we got nothing to do but it's got very little to do with what they were spending on having this digital channel right actually being on the telly that didn't cost the no 20 whatever many 30 million pounds of that is getting into drama on BBC One and it's important to know.

That BBC1 and BBC2 will have a new obligations written into their licenses which means they have to provide more content for young people and that is a big challenge to those who Charles they have to engage with younger audiences.


No, it wasn't the only change actually announced by the trust this week's CBBC is going to be extended from 19 to 9 p.m.

I remember the days when it was just the Broom cupboard for an hour and a half on an afternoon before neighbours.

What child is watching CBBC at 21 as there's been a lot of grumbling about this parents unhappy because they think it means her children to get be staying up longer till 9 potentially seaside and Perrins the BBC Trust said there is an off button, is it between 89 is for teenagers build children's what exactly yeah Press Gang I wouldn't be surprised if you seem slightly more sophisticated content being commission for those possibly be.

Freestyle stuff stuff that is going to about that is going to say to that young audience a look.

These are the kinds of things we doing on television, but you might want to check out what we doing online as well ok and they also announce cuts to sport and entertainment programming to save 150 million pounds at is that what you'd save 150 million pounds if you're in charge of these things I've I've worked I've done some work for five live been up to the office and I spent a few weeks working on one of the shows up there and I think that in terms of Middle management.

There is a huge amount that they could get rid of in a nice people there who have been there for many many years who is far as I can see often do not very much at all and yet.

They're still there and so actually potentially I come from a background of you know private sector used to work for the news the world doing your job.

You're right mate and actually like this should why not bring in a culture where buy if you're in this job there's actually not a real need for your not really doing very much you two should be out.

It's not possible.

This is it's Media you know somewhere in between there isn't it in truth there so much hand-wringing over everything the BBC does as we illustrate you know fortnite after fortnite on this show.

That's why all these midnight finish to be there just avoiding that was she seems they are now with these with a lot he's cutting to cut a thousand more manageable if such hand-wringing.

Just get rid of those people you know then you avoid the hand-wringing and and also the criticism of a lot of people but I mean that I think there's a lot of people the BBC who don't do a great deal and and they could definitely save money money money that was probably fair.

I think the BBC always traditionally struggled to make people redundant.

It's not an easy process.

They made me Rhiannon very is it remains very heavy and there is always opposition to jog carts what the BBC is saying in this instance is that content cuts will be a last Resort at however.

It is not ruled out content cuts and I think they will be inevitable and we talked about BBC3 they may

The decision to close BBC3 because they said they wanted to avoid what they called salami slicing far as I can see we've got the worst of all worlds at the moment.

We've got BBC Three closing as a linear channel and probably more salami slicing more salami slicing itself sounds like a BBC3 shirt and the worst thing is this is just a taste of things to come is 150ml in pounds at their trying to prioritise at the moment by Spring next year there will be trying to find 550 million pounds worth of savings and that I think will inevitably result in service cuts and then meanwhile and Jake maybe you can try and explain this to me.

They've announced.

They've got 85 million pounds of funding from the British government to expand services in Russia and North Korea and the Middle East at this is the same government that said the BBC have to pay for the world service because they don't want a pundit anymore.

That's right.

This is a direct diplomatic intervention.

It's not got a lot to do with the licence fee and where the BBC stand.

It's broader financial envelope.

This is the government saying we want to maintain Britain soft power overseas make sure that we are promoting the right sort of Culture two countries that caps there may be trouble brewing the thing that the Tom latchem is rolling his eyes in a cutting from places that we really really need at all.

We really like as as people who pay this money.

You know you've been talking about sport and BBC Three and all these things that people actually use as consumers who pay for the service with basically doing the government of favour our money going towards pushing Democracy in areas like North Korea have it they do the argument and engagement within government spending around foreign aid itself, isn't it that you're articulated here basically, but why are we given telly to India they've got nuclear weapons.

I'm not I'm not giving.

Push their agenda in countries where there's going to be a shoes and terrorism and and and and difficulties with they're not they're not being around the bush on that I find slightly troubling about this is how much implants will the government have over where the world services going to have put forward what sort of new services dinner launch at a time where Tony Hall the director-general the BBC is talking about independence all the time.

This is a bit worrying because he's quite happy to open up his hands when is grateful for he held up his hands when when George was one opens up his wallet also the government like the BBC when it helps them but when it doesn't there when is a cut it all you know yeah, they don't seem to be too prepared to cut politics shows of local radio.

Do they right before we go to the break? We're going to talk about making money on Twitter might be a hard way to make money, but that hasn't stopped the comedian and writer David Schneider

Along with co-founder David Levine he created that lot a company that does funny social media campaigns for brands and broadcasters, can a white label comedy basically including attention-grabbing campaigns for The Apprentice Tesco the Guardian and many more I went there offices in East London to find out how it grew into the success there enjoying today.

We both Twitter obsessives.

I was pounding away remorselessly at my Twitter account ignoring anyone in the real world and the same time was working as a director on adverts and David Levin my colleague if you want to take out the story from your side to cut a long story short satbir Twitter account for my local pub the Dolphin pub in their Hackney in East London one of them rumours on Twitter on the night of the riots was that dolphin been burnt down by the rioters which East London was an upper about because it's a bit of a Annie Sloan institution and I've moved literally across the road from it above the I in Iceland

And then cos I could see that was fine.

I tweet about it and then lots of people started tweeting replied.

I thank God for that is the only part of ever had sex in and all these kind of filter in the lower story so for a joke.

I decided to just mainly from mine my flatmates amusement.

Just set up not really a parody account Woods Canada tribute Twitter account but cold at the Dolphin pub, and then when it started in really well, I went into the pub and told them about it.

I've set you up this Twitter account and lots of people finally at a no right great.

What's a Twitter account and I was just over 3 L about it.

Did it for a bit longer and then they started noticing that they were getting busier because of a particularly during the week and they asked if I can pay me to do it but by that point.

I'd already been asked to sleep for a bit like the voice and Adidas and I was realising the full story so I went on a BBC podcast talking about mainly brands that I liked but I didn't like what the mean doing on or didn't know that great on Twitter one example was Adidas and then I was away that weekend of my girlfriend.

And got a call from hate sudden.

Sat here from Adidas with a Jew slang as often that podcast lol sorry.

Sorry sorry and they said no no we like sort of gridlock.

What you saying.

Do you fancy doing something for us around the Euro 2012 football which day was wondering so I did that which did really well for them and then I met David Schneider so you founded a company together called that lot and basically what you do is summer in the middle of the Two Worlds that you described is not telly and it's not just writing for the internet a lot of what you do is writing for the internet about TV programmes.

You're trying to create a live events around what the TV schedule is hope is alive and things like the X Factor and have I got news for you going out yet? That's it.

That's exactly right.

I think perhaps a lot the reason why it's been going well for us.

So far is that we apply a lot of the sort of TV rules and and things that both diving as my background prior to this is I used to work at MTV and then for Super greens and various production companies, but I think we've applied.

That to writing and creating stuff for social media and perhaps more so than the lot of people that haven't either worked in a TV before I'm particularly around the now I don't quite video so damn video for Twitter and Facebook a lot of that.

I think is with very very lucky that because of David background ever skills were making things that are a lot closer to the types of things you would see on TV but obviously with the knowledge of what people want on social so it's kind of a nice combination at work.

Yeah, I mean so you are behind the Have I Got News For You Twitter account a lot of people looking at that.

I think we just assume that it's the right as rumour program Associates where they call themselves on their chain now that were cracking out those jokes as well.

The idea was the whole way through the week this topical gags coming but it's not it's writing well would say we have a team of writers topical right as an everyday.

We say we have our own to virtual writing room and it's all overseen by the same producer who oversees the TV programme so we would submit the Jar

X-Men he was a yes.


Yes, no, so there is that coherence there, but I think what was important for Have I Got News For You was that things have changed in telly and there was a time where you would wait a week and store up your topical fannies and the moment of topicality and comedy would be Have I Got News at the end of the week on a Friday night whenever it was but that's gone now that model is gone now because Twitter dim the jokes in real-time and so have I got news for you recognise that they need to have that real-time presents as well because one of the things that makes it stand out is the quality of the gag which can be quite a difficult thing to do speedily as you say if it if there's a process in place.

There's that contradiction isn't there between being one of the first to get on the hashtag when you know George Osborne steps in a bottle and being the one who's got the best gang the speed with which you tweet something funny on Twitter is almost as important as the Joker itself.

I think when you say I think particularly just not even just humour sometimes.

It's anything that you're talking about it but also.

Stuart a good joke you want to do a great joke and it is about surfing that wave of topicality im getting on board at the right moment and then that the fat everyone's talking about it the or joining conversations Twitter's little catchphrase join the conversation.

He got to join it at the right moment we were talking with the CEO of the onions what they do is they just make sure that they have the best joke and so they don't worry quite so much about getting there quickly where does I think we have I got news for you live with my own account as well.

There's a sense were better.

Get the jokes to be very good quality, but also quick because everyone moves on very quickly and the style of joke is changing as social media evolves as well.

Isn't it? I mean back in 2019 thousand 10 Twitter was a one-liner platform 140 characters.

That's it now and maybe a hashtag now.

There's photo.

There's video that you are needed to earlier there a tricks you can use.

Try and get your tweet seen by more people and stick around for longer.

Does that help the joke? What does that make it harder you move with what's what's possible so now we do do images and GIFs of the things now.

You know this is very good to respond to a tweet with a gift in at least reactive gifts.

It's refreshing to see you in bracing these things because I hold no cos you're at your words with I kind of think you are I could imagine you being sort of like Norma Desmond you know it's a bit of got small not me or whatever it, Wordsworth but I'm also obsessed with the visual.

I mean that I'd like a certain generation knows me and for the comedy that I did the 90s but there's another generation our younger generation knows me as Uncle Max which is the Sword of Mr Bean visual, so that I did on CBBC shows with no words and say that I think the visual element really excite me and I'm very excited by how video and images is now working on Twitter and Facebook Facebook Fantastic Four

Video now and short video and whenever I do a video on Facebook at the it's all that is 3 set of first 3 seconds because it automatically plays without sound so you want to make sure that the first 3 seconds of your Facebook video is a what's that I'm going to click on it and listen to it, but all that being said which is all through the one thing that remains constant throughout my all the time that I've been hurt tweeter is the power of a pun and I do know there's a huge amount of you.

Give us some of you know maybe the ten of the most successful tweets that we've had AIDS I would be guessing that at least six or seven or just buns people Twitter seems to like so the fairly lame.

I know you've got one of the top of your head.

Ok, so I did 141 of tweeting for PG Tips ASDA PG Tips monkey cos that's the sort of eyebrow stuff.

I do the majority were doing was just waiting t-bag ponds one of which was don't you wish your boyfriend was hot like tea, which I think at the

Time of speaking is the most retweeted thing that of Unilever of ever had and is certainly I would not suggest as there is Shakespeare by means but I think there's just something about the immediacy and the sort of throwing nature of upon that works incredibly on Twitter with lucky and I seem to have some of the world's greatest honours upon Smiths and how does that process work out she if you listen to this and you are a freelance comedy writer if if you want to contact you and say yeah, I'd love to write puns for that.

Lot you basically get paid when it gets sent out not when you sended in Welwyn ways, we hire freelancers and right is much the same way that I've previously been hired as a freelance writer for magazines and blogs.

Just as by a day rate.

We are busy and we certainly would welcome people to her to get in touch the great thing I suppose about particularly Twitter writing is you can see very quickly whether someone is a good at it and be right for the account that you looking for her to get likes and retweets straight away you get that even just from seeing what they've done.

So what we

Send to do if someone gets in touch as interesting writing for us will ask for three or four examples of tweet for one of our accounts and you can see pretty quickly can't do whether they are right.

So yes get in touch by all means and David you're currently writing a film with Amanda annunci.

Yes, is that something that potentially could go viral I mean when you're doing any creative projects.

Are you thinking yes? This is the thing that we're going to put on Facebook order some creative project.

Just not let themselves.

That's a big feature film, but I'm at once.

It's made that time the moment thing right.

How do we now put it on social and how the how can we can best work on such as I know what you're not thinking that when you're writing it, then.

I'm getting you know what I'm thinking writing is this is hard but for example Josh Josh the sitcom for BBC3 that I directed this is just Widdecombe Josh Widdecombe if that's going out at the moment.

Josh widdicombe's when I was directing you.

I wasn't thinking about the social you think about that particular genre.

You're working on you want to make that as good as possible now.

I'm thinking right.

What's the what's the best thing we can do and social so we looked at doing a periscope so I live periscope a live feed of with Josh and Tom behind the scenes because I felt that was good.

We did a quiz to win tickets, but one that used video extraction people had to go to iPlayer to see what the officers were you know so that's a sort of clever way to drive people to iPlayer so we'll do Facebook Live which is this out this great thing where Facebook of now.

Got this live video that suddenly appears on your feet so we'll are we going to do that with the with the car.

Just looking at different ways now where you can support the traditional medium of TV or film through social seems like the kind of thing the BBC would struggle to do in and of themselves because it's scary like you say maybe you need to someone else to get out there and be there later.

I've got to try and that's where you know.

It's good to have that expertise in both feel very passionate about the possibilities.

The scope of this live video Facebook live as well because how exciting is it to the O2 to follow Ant and Dec up until they get on don't think they do do some of them Britain's Got Talent you know where this you need to know that you need to have that sort of sense of what people want of structuring it.

That's why I was working with with the postcode that week.

You know it was interesting Charles like a little chat show 10 minute chat show and then something that you wouldn't see on a chat, so here we go live backstage is the way you would have kept a bit of a little TV chat show which I think if you haven't work interview perhaps you wouldn't thing to do for a lot of the ones that I've watched where they've had access to see no big stars as though it hasn't flown that same way or they've done it somewhere to noisy having else but yes definitely a huge huge opportunity to be shown potential by definition is the possibility of achieving more in the fast-paced world.

Digital advertising Oracle data cloud has built it's like I say on finding the signal through the noise on unlocking potential we bring together data and technology to help you better understand your audience where to best engage them and how to measure a tool to realise true potential Oracle data cloud web better outcomes begin visit Oracle data cloud., to learn more from mobile car washes in gin distillers to marketing experts in good company is a new podcast from BT about small and medium businesses who dared to do more with digital in this episode.

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Ok now back to the show thanks Ollie back with me here in the hospital club Jake kanter and Tom latchem.

Let's crack on with some news in brief or news in briefs.

I should say because we starting with the sun.

That who have caused a few ruffled feathers this week with a headline one in 5 British Muslims has sympathy with Isis at first ovation who conducted the poll for the sun distance themselves from the way it was treated and then the Times news UK stablemate of the son of course corrected its own story on this survation survey saying it quite did not distinguish between those who go to fight for Islamic state and Those Who Join other factions in Syria at Tom latchem.

I think he probably was fairly clear from the question The Fighters they were talking about when they asked the question, but nonetheless the way the sun reported this story.

It was really taking you out of context wasn't things here there was an interesting a similar colour for Sky News in March showed that a high proportion of Muslims 28% showed at least some sympathy with young Muslims live in the UK sky Fighters in Syria didn't cause outrage which shows in a way that whatever the sun does there will be people who want to complain about it and you know they've had 1000 players to whip so how many of those actually read this.

Olly Murs and probably quite quite a small number of those through the sun also survation complaining about this.

What did they think the sun we're going to do I mean this is the paper who in after you know after the Paris attacks are they did they do the leader saying these Monsters have support amount of minority of Muslims dash 1/4.

Thought the Charlie hebdo going had a point.

What did survation think that that the sun was going to do with this the sun is not known for being restrained and I guess that it doesn't matter with the rising support the son of I don't support the sun.

I mean I read the son of the day, but let's let's face it.

They are not known for underpaying things and they have an agenda.

What does survation think I mean you've turned down.

They were offered to do this and they said no we haven't got time or the money to do a proper survey.

Did they do they actually think I kinda know what the something to do with it or leave it well, Let's talk about that should the sun be doing that when we're in this very politically febrile time.

What do I think? They should be doing it now.

I don't they should be doing it, but I'm not really sure the sun and I'm proper.

We not a typical sun reader would if you a Muslim they would you say being a Sunday so the BBC Two dissimilar a similar comres poll found 27% had sympathy for Charlie hebdo and they've run as a lead article.

I mean yes that the sort of 1 in 5 support jihadis have sympathy for jihadis is inflammatory but actually the BBC from similar poles and nothing because the BBC don't present it with profits reasons all the same reason people saying 27% of something but they don't present it in the screaming black and white headline because they're not a tabloid newspaper is part of this issue in the way to be nice and also it's on every street corner.

It's in every KEF isn't it's when you said people might not be sunreaders it it's there in front of their face in the way that it isn't in a BBC Weather article that with a bit more nuanced on the BBC website which is the biggest red website in the in in the country and probably in the world one of the biggest news websites in the world and it was on the front page and you know it all go back to as well whether I grew that or not, doesn't matter it's the sun and it's kind of what they

Have done historically I can continue to do before I go to Jake on this.

Just one more question which I tried to Australia what if you were Muslim leader of the sun and you saw that on the front page.

Would you be alienated from buying this and again after women how many Muslims read the sun has got a stats on that but I'd imagine it probably not a huge amount.

It's not particularly aimed at those people.

It's aimed it in a way and the Tony Gallagher nav middle England as me you know is moving it more to become what the male does he came for the male Tony Gallagher and actually it's got a feel of the Daily Mail now so actually it's it's that sort of Middle England person.

That's that's the right that's the target is not the 4% of Muslims in the country.

Did you understand me about this? It's difficult isn't it did the sun over-egg these findings at a panda to their prejudices of its readers.

Maybe I don't know did it deliberately misrepresent the findings.

I hope not is there more important journalism going on on.

Muslim attitudes to Isis yes, I think so and I think buy large the broadcasters particularly from what I saw and I'm wearing my broadcast hat here after the past tax generally got it right and they were reflecting such a good range of opinion.

We've got quite a good record in this country going back to the 77 bombings of they're not being islamophobic attacks or not register violent ones anyway after an incident like that, but but if you're editing the sun you've got to think when you publish something like that.

There is a risk that someone's going to someone who probably borrow me frankly but someone's going to enact some sort of reprisal that's the Ethical thing you need to think about when you publish amount from page as well.

Isn't it? Is you and I think about but that's probably in a way wiring up the Editors of the sun having as many other reasons why not the editor of The Sun but you know there if you edit the sun you are thinking of a different world and a different way whether it's right and I don't agree with the person who but that that's kind of what the sun does right next up this week.

We had the radio production award.

Organised by radio Indies celebrating production teams behind hit shows how cold will this year went to comedy Titan David Tyler but the interesting thing was the presents of the headline sponsor audible.

What do you book distribution company Jake they started to make positive noises to Indies in the past few months about making original content for them.

I just generally I am I right through our archive in preparation for this and doing so much at the moment.

I'm in there at funding crackanory which is Big Show on Dave they're doing this single pilot speaking which will feature comedians like Kevin Eldon and Hugh Dennis doing audio for them the hunting for original drama.

They've teamed up with the guys who creates Rastamouse which is a CBeebies show and they're doing an audio show based on that so that they're pretty serious about this stuff and there are opportunities there if you if you've got the right ideas, so they fancy doing stars in your loft.

I think there's something in this.

Is it work audio? Why has the time come in the sense of original content being a driver to Audible though and because it's something that few years ago.

Seems unlikely you go to Audible to listen to you know Hugh Laurie reading is novel and that the idea that you go to listen to radio show felt hard, but then Netflix Amazon Prime of come along and of course Amazon owns audible and now it doesn't feel so crazy that you justify your subscription of £8 a month whatever it is, so you can hear a specific program.

That's exclusive to that service if there was enough of it.

Yeah, you're probably gonna grow when I say the the cereal effect.

I'm sure that is trotted out whenever you speak about podcasts days, but I think there is something in it things the cliches for reasons and yeah people have discovered that you can consume audio in the way that you can seem television and it can be just as pleasurable alright lads come back.

We're going to

Talk about the radio production Awards now and start talking about boobs and girls and booze kiss Tom we had since the last show that FHM lad mag is closing zoo uber lads mag also closing at the end of this year, what happened her nose ring them anymore.

So pretty simple though.

There's nothing I mean I used to work for loaded as a freelance as a contributor or are they still owe me to enough grand by the way when they shut down.

Why yeah? I don't think I'll be getting that back anytime soon although his back online is it just suggest it shows in fact how we move forward in society the fact is back in the mid-90s when they were booming there was that hold of culture and people would buy it in and he would be in a boobs on the front and people would buy that something.

I think we become a bit slightly more refined also if you want lads stuff you subscribe to ladbible right because that's right there in your Facebook feed and it's funny in the same sort of thing what I think is so that she about this and people might say.

And why would we Lament the loss of the lad mag zoo doesn't count in this but FHM loaded had work to do some really great opinion.

I wrote something cos I'm very proud of for loaded that I thought would really interesting decent features good interviews and I really do think they just felt tired, but they're I truly believe that there is a place in the market for a lads mag Forfar, guys are a bit older but haven't lost it and I do mean me in that you know I mean I go to the matter you go to the train journey into the station and I'm looking for a magazine GQ is.

I can't afford you know it's full of it's for his face.

I don't know who it's aimed at people who buy £2,000 suits this somewhere in the middle where in a between zoo and and and GQ that features things for people that you can feature.

Clothes you can for the features I asked was going for with great reporters with great opinion punchy and I think that there's a place in the market for that.

I think I think I know what I don't know that never happened, but I think it's it's a sad loss, because they did do some great stuff sometimes there's also the nursery slope argument as well isn't a joke.

It's kind of like what we were saying about BBC Three and if you're in the Habit of watching BBC TV then you might go into BBC one and two in the same sort of whale FHM very clearly I happen to read it actually last month because mine was lying around the haven't read it.

Write 10 years and I enjoyed it and it but it was obvious they would virtually no advertisers in that they were literally too but it was clearly aimed at sort of sixteen seventeen eighteen year olds wear as GQ an Esquire is seems to be able to people in their thirties and I thought to myself for this is a way into getting the Habit of Reading men's magazines.

If that's gone is that generation gonna grow up to 1 origi queuing esquire.

Sexual feminist I think men probably get their carnal pleasures elsewhere these days.

They be online the real failure of these magazines is yeah, I mean people have change definitely but they've struggled to innovate online and you look at something like vice which traditional magazine and is now considered to be in this or Vanguard of online players and it did we are all metrosexual feminists then the idea that people are leaving zoo behind to go and watch hardcore pornography instead before really is it alright just before the quiz let's talk about a Mandarin uchis McTaggart again that lecture in August which you can listen to In full on a media podcast feed if you go back far enough that it looks Jake like culture secretary John whittingdale has actually listens to a Mandarin uchis concern is that true or am I being brainwashed by government propaganda? What's happening now? You're alright with broadcast wrote this story this week John whittingdale, and I'm on doing it.

She sat down soon after he delivered his that is left.

And talked about some of the concerns that he raised which is namely that politicians don't seek the opinion of program as well the point around that is Sir John McDowell pull together this sort of advisory group to consult on the future of the BBC and it contains a lot of commercial people are the people who potentially having agenda against the BBC and absolutely zero creatives and what John whittingdale is going to do now is hold two round tables one in December one in January where he will bring together some of the cream of the crop of television producers writers on screen Talent potentially as well and sitting down and talk to me about what the BBC mince them and how it should be funded and what is remix should be in the future or shaking your head is your doing this?

This sort of root and branch examination of the BBC and then cutting it and all that sort of thing and you know you're going to be announced.

What you doing in spring.

Why is it taking you to this point to meet created? It's crazy.

Why did it take to embarrass you in front of the room of way more concerned.

We are a bit of a router be honest with you.

What a surprise re-enacting imagine probably is going to be much the same way to be this time.

I tell you what I would have loved to have been sat next to John whittingdale join that he was squirming.

I was writing the other side by side has to join we have made you podcast were sitting around he did a very good as you'd expect from the Conservative Party very good slick job at wondering not to square metre what everybody got up on the floor that im at the end on Monday I know she's not John whittingdale.

I should have got up and he was sort of in two minds that when I was told by someone said he was in two minds about whether he should stand up.

Applaud or whatever and in the end, I think he he probably thought best and did do that cause itching whittingdale having on BBC Parliament and put it on Audible exactly very promising but it goes downhill from here, but indeed.

How are you going to cope with the media quiz? That is what people are asking up against this grizzled veteran Jake kanter.

I don't fancy your chances Rizzle nothing.

I was thinking he failed every time.

I try this week the media quiz is entitled order order.

Is there anything more exciting than the ever-changing UK media law it says here but can you reorder these headlines and make sense of these recent cases, it's quick fire.

So what you do to me? Is you buzzing with your name? So I don't have to practice round at that.

Tom Berry Gordy actor you got to be bit quicker, but if possible also gets bail here is disordered headline number one court Kew found contempt guilty publisher g of of it's the story about how GQ and Michael Wolff in particular who wrote the article about the hacking trial during the hacking trial was found to have caused contempt of court and maybe find well minimum £10,000.

I think it is exactly that are cheeky publisher found guilty of contempt of court was those words in the correct order Conde nast published an article by Michael Wolff during the Rebekah Brooks trial that displayed quote a substantial risk of serious Prejudice a cardinal sending something you'd think Jake every magazine publisher will be absolutely on top of the Dylan Jones the editor of GQ says he did seek legal advice icon that they told him it's ok wrong with it said alright.

One of the like I still got a job.

Ok here is disordered sentence of words number to Tim x gave Sunday evidence in Jane truthful action Jake Tim Rosen it it is simulation even got to the word.


It was the end of the sentence the sentence was Tim X Games on the evidence in untruthful action.

Yeah, which means team yogabum truthful evidence in Sunday Times action.

Would you get crazy this legal story 4sj probably was basically accused by The Sunday Times of agreeing to do some lobbying work before then sort of saying you couldn't do that and then took them to court and now I have to pay £400,000 for the Sunday Times ouch the High Court Judge describe some of the MPs evidence is unreliable and untruthful.

It's just as well.

We're not held to the same standard here isn't it right here is

The tie break her here is disordered sentence number 3 my tits radio change 2x have neck was that a simultaneous bars in I'm going to give the point to Tom because he's the newbie but you haven't actually out of the question time I got have you got it right some sort of local radio station Down in Devon decided to launch.

Not knowing radio x was launching as well now run jackets other way round radio x in Launceston forgot the trademark their name and there's a station called radio x ext dining Exeter there's name sound the same you see they do it sounds it spelt r e x e a but it said of course consecutive radio x in that if they radio station was launching it shoot expensive with a big marketing budget as they did radio x at they probably would have checked with they could the trademark the name but apparently not well.

I'm familiar with my contract at global and I know if their lawyers are listening.

I haven't commented on it at all.

So that means that the winner of today's Media quiz is Tom latchem.

Thank you very much and that is it for today my things to Jake kanter as well.

Take me to be disappointed.

I mean I'm heaping praise on Tumblr mean.

You didn't very steady job.

Thank you.

Thank you by me on if you are new to the show hello welcome.

You can subscribe to this program on your phone ill download.

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They are David ehrlich, Ian McMillan Laura Elwood and Kelly King boy also the wonderful people who set up a recurring payment.

Thank you moving us closer to the time when we can plan ahead more than a fortnight at a time at massive.

Thanks to Sylvia will check Alan Norris Richard Holmes and Paul Thompson and from Samuel fares from Independent open access science blog that lipid Chronicles 4 readable updates on the burgeoning area of scientific lipid research visit the Olympic Chronicles

Thank you Samuel

How to join the swelling ranks and keep us on the air just go to the media podcast opcom / dedicate it takes one minute, do it now, I've been only man the producer was Matt help the media podcast 8 PPM production until next time but potential by definition is the possibility of achieving more in the fast-paced world of digital advertising Oracle data cloud has built it's like I say on finding the signal through the noise on unlocking potential we bring together data and technology to help you better understand your audience where to best engage them and how to measure a tool to realise true potential Oracle data cloud where better outcomes begin visit Oracle data cloud to learn more.

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