Read this: Victoria Derbyshire’s Demotion; NBC News’ Global Ambitions; Tony Hall’s Successor
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Hello and welcome to the media podcast I'm only man who will leave the BBC after the current DJ what will Bake Off lose when it loses Toksvig and how the new global TV news network rival CNN + the Victoria Derbyshire show is axed and is shorthand duo revival we get to know the latest virtual influencer and her ai-generated poetry and see me today.
It's podcast editor of pilot TV magazine Boyd Hilton playboys.
I see you've been hosting a Q&A at the BFI nothing unusual there.
This is your life except this one was for the 21st anniversary of spaced.
Yeah, it was a good one.
There was a good one well jel yeah, they're all there had 8 people on stage which is a lot to deal with in the current situation was quite stressful still friends.
He still has Nick Nick Frost was there too.
He was filming so you can't come but everyone else every other major cast member and writer and director and it was there was it was lovely.
What do we learn? We learnt that if you asked question of Edgar 15-minutes and that's not enough time for audience questions at the end, but I managed to everyone who was there a perfect playlist delivered to your inbox after me and also joining us today making her Media podcast day is the founder of wakey Deborah Coughlin welcome to the show Deborah are you are most welcome.
What is wakey? Then wakey is an app that hasn't a 9-minute micro Breakfast Show delivered to your phone 5 days a week Monday to Friday the content is created in the Spirit of Big Breakfast it's got that kind of just fun vibe in the morning to your graphic design is presented by.
Chris Taylor who was in Love Island 2019 and did the salmon and Ginger Johnson he's one of the main MCs sink the pink dragon yeah? Yeah, we got another present adjoining next week and all the entertainment is designed by scientists experts experts and content people.
I'm glad some telling content people are involved on you boys generally daytime TV combination of them together.
What is really interesting.
I don't know how much you want to hear what I want to know I want to talk about the mental health and wellbeing so that's why scientists yeah.
Yeah, because basically I was looking at mental health in hard hit areas and we were looking at the fact that is absolutely terms of products and services out there, but there's really low engagements and so 74% of people stop you.
A well-being app after 10 years says I'm sure that you will have apps.
You have deleted may be reinstalled and deleted again where the diet and that's most people's kind of experience but loads of people actually use entertainment to regulate their emotions.
So you after a stressful day at work and love Island the only thing that's going to really tell you out or like my go-to is the American office.
I probably watch the American office 25 times in total they're like the ok, but I mean some people especially this will be ok.
Well then podcasts.
You know that's on demand what this is a TV show basically right, but it's not lie, but it from that money when we do it we recorded the week before when we did our pilot.
We did the Wall live at 7 a.m.
In the morning and it was exhausting.
Is it wasn't totally necessary people don't want it, but I just use it on the app.
You say what time you wanted to wake you up with your TV show am I mean about you when I wake up and the alarm goes off fucksake and put it on snooze that we watching a bright TV show right then so we were looking at behaviours that are not so grateful is one of them in the morning and evening so we that's why the Breakfast Show because we thought actually the morning is the time where you can help people really have a better start to the day and password that is so there is an alarm in the app that you can use to go off and straight away when you hit into the life.
It is and a chat there.
So you can chat with people it is not for everybody but it is the only mental well-being app that is designed for.
Normal people normal people who actually just want entertainment on interested in personal development some kind of way to optimise themselves can have a cog in the machine.
Just normal you actually just want a bit of a happy life and go to content but content is hardly ever designed to make people happier.
It's designed to keep people watching it so like I think it was the leadership Netflix that's actually the biggest competitor was sleep.
That's actually really concerning thing like that shouldn't be what content is created for just to keep you watching it alright.
Let's start by talking about some TV and radio Tony Hall and the blob that is how they describe the BBC this week now in our Media predictions episode a couple of weeks back earlier Seasons Media contributors warned that the corporation was going to be facing a nightmare year with the government question the licence for the rise in streaming and so on now.
We know they are losing a director general.
As well boys Lord Hall your verdict few times because of these days that hosts the BBC sometime so you know the big ones like I think Dracula Before Christmas in the BBC One flagship adaptations that should have also introduced and you don't have a few quick quick chat with him and he's always been a very nice civilized human being I think I think his main Legacy will be charged by the whole equal pay issue.
You know I think he I think generally the BBC screwed up something rotten and the whole thing is going to live a fast are 7-years very much was that I think the BBC I feel like if you look back and think weather BBC was maybe 10 years ago before his tenure when I think there are lots of question marks about it's it's it's contents is that horrendous word about doing enough good drama and comedy.
I think in terms of the entertainment stuff I supposed forget the news for a minute.
I think he's done a really good job keeping up with you know the Netflix's and the the hbos in the skies of this world.
I think it's drama and comedy have possibly been ever been a strong I think so, I think that people from the rest of that kind of girl you know you have another week.
Does a really good job that's absolutely future protected though.
I think is more features than if they just did it and I think it will get onto specialist about shows that going to be accessed and I think if they did just say you won't get the production values you get on these shows that his Dark Materials for example.
It looks beautiful as brilliantly made you won't get that.
They're going to finance themselves, but also makes it easier for them to keep up with those Giants whose budgets are 10 times the BBC's budget entirely so I think creative feel it's doing really well.
I think there are cuter shoes the news and current affairs.
How do you Mark his 7 years in the job? What are used to work at the BBC on and off for radio for and what I have some experience.
They were really what struck me about some of the announcements that have happened in the past few days is it feels like everybody can hold their breath until the election then Christmas happened and then a load of stuff happened, so a load of press releases went out that has been worked on for a while and bearing in mind the political situation.
Maybe this is what seemed best inside the timings are quite interesting up there cos I'm not people said no prediction special.
We all thought the door was going to bake off in 2019 then he didn't obviously sticking out of the centenary which is 20-20 are you I think yeah, but no it's happened now and I've seen things they were the reason for that is the government will have a role in choosing the next chairman, but by leaving now the current chairman not.
The next general want a say in what they want but that is not up to them is no shouldn't be interfering and you know I think it feels to me like that the apparently so publicly I don't think they would that affect the Daily Mail reported that number 10 sources said the rhyme did you see the hustings when they were said the Conservative Party leadership, so the the feeling that room was privatising the BBC or just getting rid of the BBC one was a very positive thing so if I was running the BBC and then very hostile set of people came in he was going to be giving me a hard time and I've been there 7 years.
I might go and do something a little bit easier and the Rumour is John written down.
Culture secretary and that's yeah.
I don't know I think he's saying he is liberty V Festival when he was culture secretary of the week and he was quite to me anyway.
Yeah, I can get every week because he felt like I had to think about his views on the BBC I absolutely ridiculous.
You know he seems to be very much and see the whole idea of the BBC miss me but is definitely not you no not in favour of the way.
It's just assuming as I think some of the people did in that in the customers that the has to be turned into a subscription service is not that simple that would be a very very complicated things to do and a strong finding a strong new head of the BBC
Hopefully will will address that knows what's coming away Dominic Cummings job advert that have been coming from somebody who was leading a cultural institution would be the best advert ever and I would definitely have applied for but it's not necessarily the group of people won't be working for but put an amazing amount of things could get broken and played and deconstructed and reconstructed with this particular attitude that you could read in that job description in reality nothing fast happens at the BBC does it use program three years ahead of time but I think fast things could happen to them.
It's not necessarily them doing it has been going to be done to them.
I think that the governments of responding kind usually don't know there's a lot of talk about how we need to renegotiate licence fee and have a conversation about in this fast changing the world added that small changes really I know it's a big deal that you took on the burden of the over 75s all that but in the grand scheme of things is not the dramatic.
You might interpret from statements for that made me think that you know it wasn't in the end.
You have these big big surveys and you know you look into the whole thing and people say things as they sorry particularly Tory ministers say vaguely and CBBC to be in the end.
I think you'll take on the BBC at your peril.
I think they think the biggest is still a very well trusted and loved institution in Ireland about it.
I'm sure about that the BBC criticised first matrix can be quite honestly stupid, but I think it's a brilliant thing and I and I think it would be almost impossible to sustain what it does in any meaningful way if you if you went to a new model and you've not which isn't about the licence does the next director-general a woman pre-match would be basically.
Skip the statistics you would have thought that there are some women out there who were very capable of running that organisation very well.
It's a lot of other large media institutions and organisations that are run by women credibly well, so why wouldn't it be strong candidates? Who are the candidates in the BBC One controller of entertainment and all the money you want the TV is controller of radio and you know that so that is their reputations having
Really badly and I'm not sure if however much money is spent on BBC sounds telling us we have to have this thing on a perfectly good at before it was I think that's gone down really badly.
So who else then so I think I know you know she's being Jeremy like you know you talk to her again and have made many times.
She's she's lost boy professional services based on said to me Jay Hunt apple.
Is it possible to Channel 4 first and then apple wasn't she mentioned? I would say that would be great experience to come back to the BBC Victoria Derbyshire
Show which we discussed with the launch editor on this show back in 2015.
I can't believe we've been there longer than that show is being axed for financial reasons that's been financial announcement was going to be made by the BBC next week, so do you take you by surprise massively? Yeah, if you try to think they should not access the way of not accent Letting Letting Victoria Derbyshire don't know by reading it in the times and rather than approaching her with a discussion about the issue first is everything about is monstrously there.
Maybe Panorama still going is it in 30-minutes or maybe acting that you know it's been reduced would be interested.
I can think of is the meaning of Bacon sundae up then heat-treated and he said it's exactly the kind of show the BBC wants to do and should be doing and then decided to get rid of it.
Play mat for underserved audiences working class Tories giving voices to diverse Talent in production is all that true.
Do you think or is that just what actually the media Twitter rtsa? I know I think there's definitely a case for that being true.
I think they've done some amazing campaigns and I just like I was bemused when I I just I couldn't I couldn't really believe it and all I can kind of fantasize about is that some kind of six music type campaign is going to happen.
That is going to persuade them to keep it on maybe Mumsnet can get really going with something.
I don't know but they're like it should be there.
I mean what we going to have just loads of Homes Under the Hammer before I wasn't it.
Yeah, you do wonder whether you know have conspiracy theory, are they deliberately doing this because it's going to pick up a massive thing I did wonder that.
I mean it.
It's not beyond the realms of possibility.
It's a story life in W1
That you deliberately choose to to access very very prestigious award winning much of my show how much how much looks like it's got one episode of materials material from it's already kicking up a stink you know everyone that the BBC has to cut it's budget 78 - 80 million what you do to the blood scheme pension scheme by the government ministers saying I know that you're the ones were putting them in the situation.
I totally get that from the BBC's point but you know I'm there must be some mediocre you no drama or whatever you can act first taste of this flagship.
One of the best discussions of Labour antisemitism and build up to the election, so I've ever seen on TV when she handles these things brilliant.
What is the secret sauce there? I was different to the way Newsnight read the story and I think she's a brilliant interview and she gets to the nub of the issue very very quickly a relation to Bates and she gave the older gentleman in the Debate the microphone and let him and he was absolutely brilliant.
We had the microphone.
I don't know maybe 3 or 4 minutes and I thought no program would have done that.
No other program would have let him keep coming back and she and she was guiding the politicians to speak directly to him and I I've never really seen that kind of just taking your time with something quick quick quick quick.
I kind of people breathe and I felt like she will allow voice through that you don't get like you don't get them in question time because I don't feel the same.
Reply to be in the audience and have absolutely no you won't get on Channel 4 news.
Is you know any question kind of programs either so I think it's the only place where you hear those voices and then the space that they deserve you back with some more meeting use after this as an apex predator the presence of snow leopards informs us about health of their environment of remote camera images and understand where these animals are so researchers have more time to protect them and their ecosystem microsoft.com mula so whatever you call money.
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Control prepaid virtual and physical card capture receipts and bring everything together into existing accounting software in your company spending it easy with no doubt find out more and get 3 months free spirit land studio a run by spiritland Productions providers of professional audio solutions to TV radio and online as well as their broadcast standard studio facilities spiritland Productions also has a world class B vehicle for audio and video projects of any scale whether it's podcasting outside broadcasting or live concert recording produce your next show with spirit land Productions go to spirit then production.com now.
I'll building what they hope is going to rival CNN
As the world's best global news network this is NBC sky World News that's not a launch name is there going to be so obviously MBC universal owns sky stop people probably some people don't realise it probably a lot of people in the street.
You know who he's got it does make sense Sky News I think is one of one of the greatest sky achievements is Sky News I think it's a really respected admired.
Generally very good news channel the sometimes.
There's a better job there and so the BBC news channel of doing that thing where you're constantly on their 24-hours a day covering not stop and then you got CNN and why and I guess you know the quotes on the NBC people have always wanted to try and work out a way of getting out MSNBC type Channel in which was big.
Character into a global audience so they giving a girl I mean I am slightly dubious because I feel like you really need you know another version of CNN all BBC News I'm not entirely sure but you know about this reading one of the stories about how it's going to be is the ladies can be launching this initiative was saying that the came to her with the idea because he spends a lot of time in hotel.
This is this is the chief executive of channel he wants to watch because he spent a lot of time watching CNN when he's in Saudi Arabia but I mean that's not most people is it you do only want you when you're in a hotel or an Airport departure lounge who chooses international news channel is really something and hurt my knee is trapped in bed.
Just watching hard news on repeat on the on the BBC I don't like I've read about it and it didn't I didn't have a second thought about it.
I really did not care.
People feel that way even on that basis it feels a bit like when Kraft bought Cadbury and something you get Oreos and Dairy Milk you really like NBC Sky News and they're not even the same thing in my mind now.
It's slightly with and also it you think they can see and then does feel like a a liberal alternative to obviously not foxnews.com later, but the current situation of news that you don't get in your hotel room if you were lucky enough to stay in a hotel alone.
I'm going to watch Fox News is run by a lunatic right wing and then it's fine.
It's kind of Liberal is and maybe you know but skynews.com to get involved and I think it still has to be you know if it's going in this country has to be completely genuine so quite get why there's no need of it who knows I don't I don't get why it's such an opportunity as it is good news for Britain there.
Isn't there going to be based in international news channel.
International channels are based in New York and then TV app that has had a lot of traction.
I imagine you are aware of Deborah is Disney plus.
It's been brought back going to be launched a week earlier than planned March 24th in the UK why so hasty subscription subscription is possibly coming to an end as the way to do channels, so I was just saying to boy before we started that there's quite a few report someone buys.
Delete recently which talk about subscription fatigue setting in and I certainly have subscriptions.
I have stuff going out my account and I look at my phone on.
When did I sign up for the army? I wanted to watch that I've got in my household.
I think you have 2 NOW TV accounts.
We have liked to Amazon Prime account.
Fixes both sets of parents use on Netflix's you know it's getting very complicated to watch the telly you want to see and you know Netflix getting a little bit poor in quality in terms of what I want to say are we going to hold on to these subscriptions know somebody's got to bring all this together and so yeah, they should go quickly because I think I think Like We Become that's going to cost people money is loads of different things coming and going to cost people money.
Do you think he has a chance but I did this marketplace.
This is the app that's going to let you know the vertically as well.
I don't get it on your on your on your phone your smartphone.
I am bewildered bike we have to say the concept but I've got some smoke providing content for it.
So that will there's a lot of data going that way watching TV on the telly the most likely to be watching it on my phone going that way with younger people.
TV executives, you know that young people don't watch TV anymore and they are watching YouTube and there are some statistics on YouTube you know and I think most people do you know move gravitates their TV sets and watch TV for Disney plus launching a week earlier? I mean they should really because their biggest hit the Mandalorian which is a Star Wars spin-off with baby.
Overdose become a phenomenon.
They need to get that out there though because not just UK weather watch instruction half of Europe as well.
It's been pirated because you know fans about that shows already finished in the Mandalorian which is a big draw and baby has become a huge thing and you can't get the toys they want to bring the toys out of the merchandise as soon as people of pirating it and people watching it illegally you know downloading it said I have to get out as quick as possible.
Have you given any thought into landscape vs.
Portrait for waking with vertical?
Landscape I can't watch it.
It's actually really hard to do a vertical video app to HQ trivia with this must have been sold by somebody that must be like right now and it's really easy but no videos not set up for It YouTube not setup for under certain circumstances cameras are not set up for it.
So we have to literally turn my camera on the side and do lots of clever stuff on Vimeo in order to get it round that way, but I think it's either.
I think it works really well.
I think it's quite exciting is that just because it feels a bit more like you're filming it though if you hold the camera if you have a small natural in your hands if you know what I think you can have commenting under it and I think that's quite an important part of watching shows now so like when I watch Love Island on bake off.
I have you know pretty busy WhatsApp groups that I get in at the same time as watching it so I think that commenting maybe something that becomes the thing and that's only really possible if you're watching it first cook.
She cannot fit common in easily landscape.
I've never asked about gas before how's your shorthand zebra secretary college in the 50s my grandma went yeah, and it's amazing what I've done some writing and some German and I definitely think that it is it would be a lot easier for me if I had had the skill of shorthand go to press junket after pressing kit on my phone.
So it was useful to anyone you think boy help me would be using it.
I mean I don't know and it's ridiculous.
I asked because the editor-in-chief of the UK's big news agency has said job applications he received without shorthand go straight in the bin.
Clifton is he wrong then to say new recruits should have it as to whether or not is useful and there's whether or not it's indicative of someone who's really the effort to try and become a journalist.
They gone and got some training so that means they really want this one of the best most committed genocide no Sarah Graham and she doesn't blow cold hysterical women chino shorthand and I just think that like she went and she did she did a proper journalism course to the proper journalism degree like she took that route.
I took it ended up writing almost completely by like we're throwing paint each other for 3 years basically and I just don't yes she treated it as a craft.
You know she understands that has can I really I really admire that I've always admired her for that but I think you know the different types of Janice different types of writers and I can I would definitely love someone on my team he could do shorthand.
So beat this guy that you said is wrong when he can people be a court reporter ok fine.
No transcript to what you know you need to quote the what's happening the proceedings very accurately as quickly as possible I can see there was short had been almost every other regard people record on their phones.
Everyone's got a recording something about electronic record of some kind and it's my time whenever I was when I first found out the people some people do interviews conducted interviews Big name rytas.
You know cannot get newspapers.
Just writing notes write in shorthand notes.
They don't record after an extraordinary like a absolute word-for-word what someone says verbatim what you most of the time.
She's ideal for heating pipes at work for our Q&A format if I'm not quoting every single word.
They say actually I feel like it's wrong.
Where is he can't get that received from just writing.
Transcription transcription there isn't a really is there a really easy transcription app it is protecting yourself if you know that the person interviewed also is not keeping a recording then actually you are reliant on your shorthand notes.
I mean that could actually be quite a good defence could not prove otherwise that wasn't said I guess so but I think I just think nothing suspicious when I know I've only got my life.
No one else can read another Circumstance am generally used for is when they're basically got something to someone or they having a intimate but not obviously professional encounter with I get some information or sensitive thing you know someone just lost their child and they've gone up an approach them somewhere as soon as you say do you mind if I record?
What you legally have to if you're going to use that they will come up and not talk to you, but they won't notice necessarily or feel.
It's intrusive thing for you to be writing it down to be honest.
I've never been so I know I have to be like as a TV and film critic an interview with celebrities and actors is not needed at all by example.
Of course when I do get my recorder and even with it with photos of behave differently when they do earlier than that goes to work for some of you know I Media organisations recruiting, but she's not the production companies working with recruiting for day and she made a point of saying this is in Leeds I'd love to have people work on the show you haven't worked in telly before and I like shorthand does Kinder mean.
Works really hard to pay yourself through University don't have to be privileged, but it does kinda mean you've had to spend money.
You've had to go through traditional maybe it's only thing for some people.
Yeah, I mean 100% I think that it would be really difficult to get an incredibly diverse group of people in your organisation if you were stipulating that everybody had to know shorthand before they got their contractors.
It's obviously ridiculous, but I think the idea that it's a bad thing to have is definitely not the case.
I just think this guy is I mean he's trapped in the Trap somewhere in the corner of your expertise spoil which is the Great British Bake Off leaving why is she going who's going to replace it to be honest? I've never got on with them the the Toksvig the current.
The holy very much of the old school it was it is peak in the BBC days in men and soon I think I've got right from the start that the channel for sending duo.
I've always thought that the duo of Noel Fielding and Sandi Toksvig felt contrived and comparison and I think a lot of jokes you can see my locker a bit like try hard and I think the show is still I love the show still with people that was also in terms of being slightly harsh to the to the contestants.
I think she's generally I really like her as a present and she's fantastic and it's funny and witty and all of that but I did not get on with that duo as a prospect for Bacup I think Channel 4 needs to be really careful get someone who is genuinely has a kind of affection for the sense that she had a particular you know love of the show or picking or have you know that thing.
You make things seem a joke about two years ago before she was put into the show that it's just people making fun of them.
So ensure get someone really good who's who will work better you need a job advert.
Would you put in the role? Did you try and win back Mel and Sue would you get Joe branding Nicola Coughlan from Derry girls was obviously somewhere with his going long hair from queer eye.
He does the hair with gather and she announced that he wanted to be the new replacement presenter for bake off and then he has continued that on his own Twitter and Instagram and I think that would be an affiliate or that it will be a bit Duty they wouldn't if you had to do don't think it would be du ddu-du ddu-du.
Ladder but do but I still think I don't know I feel like you got have a Lisa Tarbuck you need to presenters at all.
I mean the children's one which is the only one I watch because my 4-year old is in and he is he doesn't really well and if that was a bit of a strong flavour for people.
I think it proves that one person can present the show I think what I don't think that one person is necessarily the person that's left.
I think Lisa Tarbuck is the best call I've heard but on his own and served with someone else.
Let me know it doesn't doesn't want to let go just because it's going but I think it's good to know I love them both separately as Talents but never felt as a duo for this is it was to get Noel Fielding in the first it was it was so you can understand that Sandi Toksvig
When was getting 30 million viewers on those judges in the Mary Berry days? It was a perfect combination of it was a perfect TV show and I feel like since then.
It's not as perfect what you want more VTS about Vienna cake so one more thing but tell me the history of this type of licence renewal conversation.
Do you know what the news is here? You're looking as it's the character of a poo poo.
Yes or not also LED the collaboratively in The Simpsons theme of decided that he will no longer be voicing a poo some years after that documentary questioning the whole thing anyway as a bit racist but they come to the decision.
I mean you can't even in this day and you cannot have black faces and it really is it's not far away from that so I think you was inevitable just rather a long time.
I don't have to get rid of interesting isn't it? So yes, it's a stereotype in that you have an arranged marriage and he's got 7 kids and around the corner shop, but that's not the objection primarily objections is a white man voicing him that I don't think the old white guy saying that but I didn't get the sense that there was a general offence taken at the character by many people but there was at the fact that it was playing position because you know if you get rid of a character.
You're getting rid of the only south Asian representation in The Simpsons The Simpsons good anymore.
here we go that's the more fundamental question is kind of like Simpsons used to be one of my go-to like the kind of thing I've watched on repeat again and again and again and I don't think I've watched The Simpsons never less than 3 stars like the first time that influences to get ready to meet the virtual influencers social media personalities images and sometimes words are computer-generated magazine the drum has created a virtual influencer to be there February cover star all our guests need to do is answer 3 easy questions about how are you buzzing with your name when you know the answer so bored you will say boy and
Say let's go drums virtual influencer is a 25-year old cold, but what does the name mean in Portuguese boys Boyd at correct flow as she's otherwise known as a Brazilian Portuguese woman based in the UK he wants to raise awareness of environmental issues through Instagram posts, is it ridiculous to think that Avatar flow can influence anyone really that's why I think it might be psychologically for an influencer to be a made-up character than a natural person.
Yes, so that's that's one thing.
I just think it's plausible and I think it's going to happen and it's kind of inevitable number two.
Can you name one of the two agencies who help research and program to rest his profile and personality with your name when you know one of the two answers.
I'll give you a clue one of the agencies is called.
Virtual what it says on the tin the virtual is influenced by the virtual influencer agents Algarve at the agency's called live and influenced by the other agency at the rest of post images rendered by vis design team shares poetry penned by a neural network produce original verse and hold conversations with followers produced using natural language processing software that can effectively make a tone.
This is the end of civilization the missing words challenge that's all.
I'm going to read you a line of poetry posted by flow and created by algorithm.
All you have to.
Guess the missing word unload her weeds Forest Italian Lily in the Mire and throws of tolerable.
What are so close void did you know that no guess that yeah, I mean like phonetically very close, but often it is a river.
I don't know the four letter word that begins po Court it's pump pump yes, it's never invite someone virtual well.
It was generated by inputting the work of William Wordsworth into the AI machine other lines include pill the oak tree with Jasmine Clough colours.
We're only here to make the happiest guy gets involved in this and still cuts the Victoria Derbyshire
On the quiz congratulations you go to follow on Instagram if you like or up to you on the media podcast and you help us keep doing it that you consider taking out a voluntary subscription head TV media podcast.com / donate and choose an amount to keep us going for year-round you catch up with all previous episodes and get new ones as soon as they're subscribing for free on our website via Media podcast production mula so whatever you call me give your team that how to spend and grow your business with you can't it out and control prepaid virtual and physical card.
Everything together into existing accounting software in managing your company's spending is easy with no doubt find out more and get 3 months free at ao.com.
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