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Read this: 03/07/2020

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03/07/2020…



BBC sounds music Radio podcasts hello, can we do better the world as a whole I mean not just feedback that was the question and rethink a collaboration between 3 BC networks, how well did it work the idea of the series about rethinking Society post pandemic is an excellent contributions advocates.

You really new ways to organise a future which was meant to be what this project was about a question.

We will be put into one of the main Architects of the recent series of programmes BBC Radio 4 factual commissioner Richard Knight and his Crowd Control a suitable subject for scientific study.

There's been a bit of an argy bargy between some of our listeners.

I feel like crowd psychology doesn't come within the realms of science just because a practitioner keep saying it does BBC Radio science editor Deborah Kerr beg to disagree.

I would argue.

I know that some people think that signs is the traditional subjects of Physics chemistry biology, but it is a lot broader than that these days.

We will discuss in our out of your comfort zone feature.

Did we make our International Business and comfortable this week? It's not promising going back to the idea of stories and boy.

Did he have some anecdotes find out what I live in Poland and Australia are talking about later in feedback.

Last week the BBC launched reefing a week of program spanning BBC Radio 4 Radio 5 Live and the world service in st.

Wish to ask what why do lessons we can learn from the coronavirus prices and what should we change to improve our lives after his across the week distance between a short essays from around 50 plus think about what they want it to happen the cast list was remarkable contributors included the Pope Prince Charles Neil Ferguson Tara Westover and Andy Murray their ideas and many others were used in a variety of programs to provoke debate.

This is some of you thought about the series Jane creasy.

I thought the edge of change was exceptional it was an extraordinary lineup fancy getting Tony Blair George Osborne Kevin Rudd Michelle a current Hungarian senior politician all on at the same time to think deeply about me.

Strategic challenges and opportunities I loved it Dylan Watkins asking establishment figures who have contributed to the problems of our current Society fair ideas about change is a horrible missed opportunity Let's Hear instead from Radical thinkers from critics of the status Quo from those on the margins of powerful influence in society working class people ethnic minorities the young Catherine I'm running a rethink series very good indeed food program.

Especially with excellent, thought-provoking full of hope so good in fact that I listened twice Carolyn Jameson it is really nice to have programs that I've taken a different angle on a topic that is never far from the airwaves.

I especially like work from the Long View team as it reminds us that we are only a very small part of History

Christmas and overall we think is worthy Earnest and consequently often rather dull initiative to the most of us know what desperately needs changing.

What is that how to and who will carry it out? That's the challenge Cumbria after the week's rethink Talks by many famous people across Radio 4 and 5.

I was really looking forward to Sunday evenings phone in to my great disappointment attorney when most gasp and it's given time to turn out Hackney rhetoric, but the contributions allowed on from listeners will not only repetitive but entirely banal shop local work from home etc.

Etc.

Where were the contributions advocate you really new ways to organise a future which was meant to be what this project was about well, I'm doing.

To be joined by Richard Knight the commissioners for Radio 4 factual with particular responsibilities for current affairs and one of the main Architects of rethink Richard where did the idea come from of cooperating and then making it work across three networks this really started with us after a period in which we had to work quite hard to keep radio for going in the audiences.

No in love lockdown.

We began to turn our attention to what happens next not just for us but for everyone and it seems to us that the pandemic has the potential to be a kind of historic moments after which changes quite likely and we wanted to create a space where we could encourage thinking about what kind of change.

We might expect or want but why do I put three networks Liberty reason for that one? Is that this has been and I'm really sorry to use this word, but in our lifetime certainly mine and unprecedented moment and it felt like it required.

A very big editorial response and by collaborating with five live on well service we were able to amplifier efforts but he did also actually in a way that I found quite satisfying in use the particular expertise of each other's network so kind of international dimension 5 Live are very good at speaking to and getting the views from there.

So that was a part of it and we at Radio 4 if I can put it like this.

I felt we could bring some intellectual heft to the whole thing by listening to increase he was impressed by the cast list on Russian censorship change Tony Blair George Osborne Kevin Rudd the former prime minister of Australia but as Dylan Watkins said they are establishment figures who have contributed to the problems of our current Society do you think that you went for the establishment? I mean they've had they say in the past.

Why do you give them this opportunity? Is it now well, I said he can't claim that we didn't have any establishment names are we have the Pope and Prince Charles surname?

But he did also have a lot of new things of the type.

I think that's what I like to hear the why did you decide that goes from the past but those who had an opportunity in particular for a prime minister of Coal Pit George Osborne for number 11 Downing Street why give them? What did you think they had to offer now apart from a degree of Prestige the two it is really important to understand that it was so cute 50 + SAS another 20 or 30 contributors including those you mentioned in discussion programmes and debates on 3 networks, but quite likely that no two listeners.

Have the same experience everything and all the attention needs to be considered as part of a very much wider hole and I would just had actually because I think it's worth saying that the place we get hold of it is the podcast and there I think you can see this very wide mixed we were achieved, but underlying that comment is the idea as you say that perhaps we should have avoided.

It is completely and I don't really agree with that position.

I think the idea that we should write off aldermore service think is anyone but the record in government and therefore associated with the past.

I'm not sure how that is the point of a rethink or whether actually this is a restatement of values and saying we have to find new ways of implementing these things but actually we've always agree know what we should do will this crisis gives us the opportunity to do it and do we know how to do it so that the ideas.

We thought or was the implementation of those ideas.

We thought we were able to tell us about some damascene conversion that the pandemic and I'm not sure that's how people actually work.

Think is the idea that the Themes that will dominate our future are already there the ideas are already lying around but the pandemic might Accelerate I think I think is articulated ideas, which I admit were in line with their free virus with you, but perhaps a new agency to talk about the fighting inequality green Solutions international collaboration improving public health services rasmussen says we know what needs changing but the how to undo who will is the challenge was that challenge med during this series.

I think it's a really good point and I certainly had considered as being both creating this thing but there was a danger that there would be a gap between ideas and blue sky thinking and kind of real-world practical concrete actions that could be taken you wear leavers that one has to pull to create change and that is why we commissioned the discussion programme that ran Midway through anything week with Louise Casey Simon Lilley Matthew Taylor and modern talking about.

I'm actually affect change what are the components of an idea the required for that idea to turn into action or change opinion Chris Masons phone in at 10 I think on Sunday but she didn't offer any really new ways to organise our future is that fair is a horse I have to say I have a different view of that phone in program.

Because another potentially dangerous gap.

I thought was between very big blue sky thinking and more Human Scale thinking this is a big Society global event but also deeply and literally personal for all of us and I think the fact that people who called the phone-in programme tend to focus more on that was Human Scale me thinking if I would argue that was no bad thing.

I'm looking forward to it mean.

It's a great danger.

Obviously when prices are over we forget very quickly but as quickly as we forget New Year's resolutions to be not drink as much or

Whatever, so do you see this as being a one-off or do you think in Radio 4 in particular in the future? You are going to return consistently to some of the themes and ideas that have been developed in the recent season of How various things did emerge from our speakers are not planned inequality came up time and time again in so many different ways how we think about climate change perhaps.

You should be expected that he came up again and again questions and personal responsibility cooperation leadership into dependence these games and emerged from this very diverse mix of people from all over the world and I think they perhaps do point to areas where we ought to be thinking more deeply about coverage over the next hour to my thanks to Richard Knight the commissioning editor for Radio 4 factual with particular responsibilities for current affairs and one of the main Architects of rethink and please do let us know your thoughts about that interview and anything else.

BBC Radio this is how you can get in touch you can send an email to feedback at bbc.co.uk or write a letter to the address is feedback PO Box 67234 London se1p 4ax you can follow activity on Twitter by using that BBC R4 feedback we can call us and leave a phone message on 03345 standard landline charges apply, but it could cost more on some mobile networks all these details are on our website last week.

We had it from to international listeners Dr Susan Bowden from Australia and Michael Thomas from Krakow in Poland we asked them to step out of their comfort zone's and listen to something that would normally be on their agenda this week.

They back listening to the SA it's a hack.

Michael Goldfarb on Radio 3 before we start reminders, why do you listen to BBC Radio in the first place, but it's just the sheer quality of the broadcasting which you know I just find consistently good and the other thing I was just a bit strange.

It's somehow a bit more freedom to listen to issues as they occur in another country.

We are not responsible for a lifting the politicians to solve the way you don't have the same level of Engagement somehow that helps he through to the issues and what about you Michael you're an expat Michael Thomas living in Poland with Polish wife and now retired he works all over the world, but it's still listening to Radio and Radio 4 why I just love the BBC Radio is so rich and now I'm interested in theatre in the Arts and Arts coverage is second to none.

I kind of Nostalgia for the BBC I've always really enjoyed yourself.

Michael if you had three programs you can take what would they be there Today programme and then In Our Time and cabin Pressure that you Susan Boyle I love Saturday review and loosens.

I am a bit of a sucker for the Arches to I have to say in both pre and post card forms ask you to talk about is the SA it's a hard life first broadcasted 15-minutes of every day on Radio 3 and as always have got available on BBC sounds really describe this essay.

Is equally troubling quite moving really an account of what it was like to be a journalist trained in the 20th century and probably with loyalty to early 20th century journalism as opposed to news for entertainment and how the world changed.

Changed around that particular journalists, I found it fascinating.

What is in which he operated for 2 years ago and The Wasteland that he was looking at today.

Do you think he mixed the political and the if you like historical it in a way that there was enough general analysis of what happened, but that his own personal story didn't overwhelm that or intrude because that's the danger in these things isn't it is to place you at the centre of events as if you're terrible as opposed to an observer of them absolutely agree with Susan there.

Is it was actually quite moving and pass it was a human story and he found this perfect balance between him as water and the human story in history and if you like and these enormous changes that have taken place in journalism undergraduate was further episode 1.

Interrogated the idea of fake news and the manipulation of the use and so on and distortion of use in some cases, you know talk to one point search engine optimisation and simply to ensure that it pops up in the right place and social media people read it is I've done quite terrifying but Susan to get the structure right.

Obviously have a talk like this 13 or 14 minutes put a long time to listen to it a single voice so the voice and the Waves red is crucial.

Did you think he did it well? Yes, I think he did it fantastically and he has many doesn't he has literally a voice in terms of his opinion his expertise, but he also has a little.

Physical voice and he has such a distinct and such a different way of Reading and the added enormously to to the Xperia back to do just go along with that start off you wanted to be an actor for something about that film with the Wind are perfectly absolutely hypnotic want to be first the news business has been built using new technology to be first going back at least into the mid-nineteenth century Joseph Lloyd laid down the template he built a News business on the year as new technology the Telegraph and where wires word yet strong use carrier pigeons to bridge the gap between a little bit Christy Moore possibly and say this and it was a very good son.

About the way the world has changed his own personal experiences, but was there anything really fresh in their Susan I mean? You know if you wanted to say to a younger person and perhaps a non journalist.

This is what's in the last 40 years.

It would be good if you return to a journalist or somebody would be in a up-to-date with on politics and political discourse.

You say well.

That's not a bad somebody but I knew most of that knows that no, it's not affect your level, but I think you know isn't the word about Adolf intensity, isn't that what we're all thinking and I think there's nothing like the authenticity of someone who simply been there the power of someone who talks about writing an obituary for Marie Colvin you know that's an incredible experience that was delivered so Susan we've had a bit comfort zone and the answer is clearly no, but the second question is would you listen to the essay again absolutely individually and as a

Absolutely fantastic and I'm down a document before and since they move off the stage and kind of hope I think he isn't in what we lay down for the Next Generation coming hope sometimes it's getting off the stage and then the next generation come and work so I found it just a wonderful wonderful radio experience and challenging and unexpectedly moving my thanks to Michael Thomas in Poland and to Dr Susan Bowden in Australia and we've already heard from all listings in Italy South Africa who would like to be put out of their comfort zones.

science programmes on BBC Radio Aprilia popular at the moment with everyone preoccupied with a certain coronavirus, but is there a temptation to put code into everything from a Life Scientific to run my Radio 4 be missing covering other important science stories such as climate change is the BBC Radio science editor responsible for all the other programs on the saddest song radio for and the world service welcome to feedback Deborah squeezing out of the stories and particularly climate change has been such a good story and it's obviously effective everyone's lives but I think it was right for us to spend a lot of Our Time covering covert because there's been so many new angles to it as over the last 6-months so we have done a lot on covert to say having said that we have tried when we think the time is right to do stories on other subjects so we did London

Several months ago on Inside Science programs like the Life Scientific we made a conscious decision to effectively keep away from covid-19 working directly on covert the only exception to that is the one we did with start which was really we decided to do that after we were aware that black lives matter had meant to people out on the street, so we thought we should do something on Crowd Control it was in a context where there were lots of protests against lockdown that were predominantly pro trump rally send and I don't think that anybody could have foreseen what's happening now in relationship to the contrary the protests and the death of George Floyd Kevin I was fascinated by Clifford Stott in the latest edition of this great program is clear explanation as to why the traditional view of crowd and riot control.

Correct with compelling alternative theories about why people riot with convincing practical research.

I really felt I got an insight into an alternative you about hell rights and disorder could be tackled in a more practical and effective way.

This is Andy Thompson from Worcester Park this week's Radio 4 Life Scientific control interesting issues, but it was something to do with science.

It was surely have been much better covered in the programme outside that series where more pertinent questions could put to the interview in a field of study that crowd psychology doesn't come within the realms of science just because a practitioner keep saying it does the temperature in Andy Thompson their questions whether Crowd Control is an appropriate subject for science programs in did specifically for the Life Scientific is it yes, it is.

Yes, it is and we've always in the Life Scientific cover the full range.

From social psychology through to quantum computing you know Sciences and approach.

It's the way you go about studying things.

I would argue that yes, it is so I know that some people think that sign is the traditional subjects of Physics chemistry biology, but it is a lot broader than that these days.

What makes a really good Life Scientific does it have to be a combination of the individual story and the area of science of the illumination well.

I think they're always very good ones where you do get a personal story and a really a fascinating area of science that has a immediate in some people's lives, but I think a lot of other Life Scientific so extremely successful that are just about someone's passion for what may seem to be a slightly obscure piece of scientific enquiry.

I think people like both of them.

You know it just shows it's about the person how much they love what they doing.

What can I talk to you more broadly about the question that keeps coming up periodically this one of them.

The BBC always thinks if somebody says one thing you've got to have somebody on the other side.

He says the opposite regardless Innocence of his right.

This is what Margaret Cox address is reliable scientific studies are reviewed by expert peers and then by the scientific community so it's very important that reporters and presenters do not fall into the trap and practice or fall through the evening that they must always present and opposite view to be fair like you might political comment it will be like giving equal weight and important to for example those who still believe the Earth is flat, so that extended return to operate differently from the political correspondence.

You do make a decision about whether a view is scientifically based on not generally we would always find someone you're quite right to come along and say I think this is wrong.

We do say Sciences and to fix body of knowledge, and it is constantly being changed by people coming up with new ideas.

It's a case of when is.

Going to bring in the idea for someone outside the field because it offered to someone outside the field to will come up with a new a challenge that might lead to a new way of looking at a problem.

So it's always a decision you make about every story and hopefully the presenters themselves can do some of the Challenge Christian Midgley from Lochwinnoch in in Renfrewshire I have been gorging on the Life Scientific during lockdown mostly which is a really fantastic program one thing which was particularly struck me is the equally wide range of Educational background of the scientists not Oldham Oxbridge or even the Russell Group institutions the BBC is guilty of often referring to Top Ranking universities or a good universities or students, who do well we'll be able to upgrade to better universities so picking up Christian Missionaries point do you think you have a wide enough pool? Do you automatically go to one of the Russell Group of Oxbridge

Go for that person and not actually seek out often enough people who may be in operating a subway from the centre, but they're doing a really interesting things we don't look at which university people are from that's not the first place.

We would go to look what we would look at is the person and their research irrespective of where they are studying it is true to say that a lot of these people probably are as the research heavy universities in the UK that will be Russell Group universities and Oxbridge probably but some people who talk to connect with university.

They working in a we do engineers who work in industry.

We do people work in other research establishments that are run by government funded organisations also taking commercial work.

I just wondered whether or not your previous experience covering major stories like BSC foot and mouth and son were any help when it came to the coverage of Kobe or is it so different that you really have to stand back and say we can't.

We must research we must compare we must analyse and then comes with you.

I think this is a different kind of story.

We've not had a condition that is global in the same way.

I think it away we looked back to the SARS outbreak in East in Asia Asia and also in Canada and other places in 2003 and saw what was learnt from that seems a very good model place to start and that has obviously informed a lot of research has gone on a Labs into the virus, but it's something is global is this you have to look back at some people have compared it with the influenza of at the end of the first world war but of course we didn't have the science around at the time and we didn't have travel that was quite as fast as this is such a different disease.

I don't think we can learn a lot from what's gone before my thanks to Deborah Cohen BBC Radio science editor who is no relation of Deborah Cohen BBC

Can I program also got the science and that's it for this edition of feedback next week well, that's up to you.

So please get writing and keep safe keep separate goodbye.


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