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Egged on by the Press?…

BBC sounds music Radio podcasts from BBC Radio 4 of The Daily Mail for weeks on different tone in office, but not in power was the front page yesterday the murderer isn't the only paper now you turning on Liz truss, so what exactly is her relationship with press which she really egged on by the media as some have a critics claim to do what she did in the disastrous mini budget and if the opinion polls are to be believed with a party apparently heading for Oblivion and a general election what traditional Torah paper switch allegiance because after all what price are likes the publicly back a loser to discuss all this and John by James O'Brien presenter on LBC Christopher hope of the Daily Telegraph Elena career deputy editor of politico, London Playbook which is a daily newsletter.

We also going to get a view from abroad on all this is London Bureau

Times Tesco's should give its rights for German and Austrian publications welcome to you all and I have to say you know it's felt like the last 4 weeks news has been happening happening happening and we have another is just as we're coming on our which is you know the news that the home secretary suella braverman has departed the government no doubt we will come to that but for the moment let us go back it feels a long time ago, but it was only a few weeks the mini budget James O'Brien MP Tobias Ellwood on Newsnight on Monday night said that Liz truss was egged on by parts of the media to do what she did in that many budget.

Do you agree with that? I'm fine yes part of the media and also these strange organisations that call themselves think tanks that have actually been boasting about the influence that they have exerted on Liz truss over more than a decade and indeed the Glee with which they greeted claims that they somehow managed to infiltrate the very heart of Downing Street the the notion that by sort of fetishizing epoch wealth and allowing huge corporations and extremely wealthy individuals to do.

You will somehow in which the entire population and look after people who are struggling to pay their food bills was always doomed to fail the only surprise of the last 4 weeks is just how quickly it all fell apart.

I'm going back to a tweet of yours what you said just had a mini budget.

This is a full fat right wing Tory government and improvement on the relatively skimmed milk versions of David Cameron Theresa May Boris Johnson a huge gamble but one which Liz truss is prepared to take it.

You didn't call it an improvement.

You can get to make you disappear that I mean not sure what he thinks about Boris Johnson to the idea what to get her a clear answer in there and a clarity on taxation.

I guess a lot of thought the homework and been done.

They're done the forecasting that preparation.

Call gonna work no one saw, what was round the corner which was a complete disaster pretty straight forward to wait 6 to 8-weeks and they went earlier.

I don't know so worried about I don't know what they won't what drozin to pronounce all in it at that busy 2-day period after the Queen the Queen dies at the end of national mourning period for all until October 31st or later in November do it all then with the working if they chose not to believe they thought that well.

They're busy discussing who might be leader the debating toryism amongst themselves over 12 different in person who sings along with numerous different TV on the BBC on LBC and elsewhere that now let's get on with it with them correctly the rest of the country won't pay attention or on holiday and then they came out with.

Quite a radical left to the right match which was not in the manifesto.

I never had one touch lighters.

It's not least because I went on the TV the following Sunday on the the Laura Coombs Berg program anymore tax codes without any idea how to pay for the original ones and it's no wonder that the the the markets pulled up on the on this country and gave my right spanking and what about the contest I'm in it felt long time.

I mentioned it back in a how influential.

Do you think the British papers were on how the Tory membership voted in the Daily Telegraph with respect to Christopher and the Daily Mail speak to and they would be hugely overrepresented mail and Telegraph he doesn't in the Conservative Party membership so apart from Krishnan guru-murthy, are there any of the Customs House really picked up on the nonsensical nature of Liz truss his promises are the British soon outlines about Fairytales and fantasies have as a so happy.

For the last 6-years treated as an equal and opposite opinion to what is trust was saying where is he had evidence he had fact he had calculations and Intelligence on his of course.

I mean specifically its influence on the Conservative Party represents a particular way, and what would you say to James O'Brien's points what we have done? What what I really think many the more conservative.

We have a give you a buzz on low taxation and we are in tune with what the Conservative Party thinks I think after I think the second or third round of voting of Tory MPs we didn't back anybody actually the last time as a contested leadership election David Davies against this time.

We thought we could back somebody I think you know we we talk if you won't go with with you know when we are interview Rishi Sunak from the newspapers for my podcast the podcast at 6.

Listen downloads on top of politics by the way, thank you both so it was a bit like the Tory Party talking to self exclude anybody else and that was only frustrating think there's looking in weather in future.

You have members choosing a new prime minister and analysing honest Cavan to go into hibernation for about 8 to 10.

I think he's up for grabs right now and I'll politics well it can feel like it's going to be a little bit.

It's got a little bit different little bit tensed at the moment, but should give it to you and you respond of the German give us an outsiders perspective.

What do you make of all this? It's always interesting to see how quickly tablets make and break prime minister's I mean it's not that in Germany built item doesn't have a considerable power tool in order to influence politics, but it's not so well.

It's not so I shall I put it I mean so clear and it's power presentation which may be due to you know German brush with total realism and the knowledge about being seen as a propaganda tool for someone it's may be really careful since then but in principle.

It takes a lot for politician if of a medium-sized European country to get heard all across Europe and so list to ask her that handicap for us that she was practically and know when she started her leadership campaign and it's not quite easy to repeat her name off in an Oxo that editors would actually get interested in a story Boris Johnson had a completely different sort of attention.

Yes and so it was for as long as a lot easier to present him and his Flaws and his Talents then it was for us to prison.

Interesting in Mark from the New York Times Mark landler, what's your respective on all this? What's your take? Well unlike Britain we don't have a sort of a traditional paper openly parties and as you have here.

So what would you have of course? There's a cable TV business that sort of plays that role? What was interesting about watching this on folders you have a president in the US who is also fighting his own kind of economic battle from a very different ideologico vantage point and actually felt obliged to wait into the Debate and he was quoted the other day as talking about how what is trusted was a mistake.

It was a tax code for the super wealthy.

I think that reflected probably a little bit of concern on the part of the white house that they didn't want Liz truss is ideas to take any route in Washington which is in the middle of its own election season they probably didn't want Republicans in Congress to start talking.

There was a new Ronald Reagan over in in Britain and maybe we had a start looking at that so he did something a bit unusual for an American President not unheard of Barack Obama famously awaited into the brexit Debate a few years ago, but you know obviously some here cookery lumberjack dad and told I don't mind his own business, but you know it.

I just that was in British politics which you know doesn't really impinge on American politics all that often these days did in this case and it probably shows a little bit the tensions around economic in the United States as well.

I'm going to bring both of you back in later there more about how the rest of the World is saying this but Eleni career from politico.

I want to bring you in or trying to get a sense of how Liz truss operation is working at the moment.

I'm just today the one of our advisors has been suspended for reportedly briefing against the former Chancellor Sajid Javid using very earthy language assessment of honeydew operation.

It's quite difficult to see you and it's quite interesting thing is that in the last week because he last week when it was really quite a few senior advisors were often holiday at the same time which obviously is completely fine, but it was really telling how things that are rated to that such an extent that time when senior people were killed in the 10 and the Treasury away and clearly the most important influence advisors and just today.

She's lost one of her actually Keith Vaz somebody who worked with her before she would somebody who worked on her digital campaign and who is essential to another operation and it's really interesting seeing how a backbencher in this case I did David and affect me kind of scalp there.

He said you've got a century demanded that this advisor of be suspended and investigated over these briefings.

At this point exactly the real side weakness a backbencher can just has been able to do this and take out effectively a member of the stresses top team over episode possibly against him and it's all about you, then we do operation.

How do you assess it at this point young people doing their best as you get older Katie all the police look younger and clean the politicians.

Have a lot younger than me and I'm concerned about the lack of experience lack of knowledge of of how the hell these mistakes they made off and it's on a repeat doom liberties politicians are ways to avoid these mistakes.

I think I think it's ok.

I think the adviser who's been suspended is particularly good one actually you can see around corners not so it seems that she's in battles Liz truss losing IKEA vases leaving home secretary this afternoon as speaking right now.

It's available position.

I thought you did ok today, Wednesday

It appears on Thursday and Friday on the the podcast.

I don't know that the brexit for me because obviously 6-years the Conservative Party has been higher up on fantasy myth and the promise of delivering unicorn to Boris Johnson was brilliant at he managed to sustain that life and much longer than could have been expected nobody else could have done that the only person that's always trust might be able to keep the balloon at bloviation inflated was Liz truss.

I think it's popped almost immediately on on exposure to reality I mean they might be young they might be talented but the people that surround his trust just like the people that surrounded Boris Johnson have been prepared into Danny Street on a platform of lies that are now finally even Christopher's newspapers running about her project has turned out to be right about everything gravity is kicking in but if we look.

At yeah the media operation what's been going on recently you know today your papers front page headline was that trust me a band and Pensions triple lock.

That's a manifesto pledge to raise pensions in line with inflation on the airwaves this morning James cleverly the Foreign Secretary didn't disagree with that and then we find in prime Minister's Questions Liz truss contradicted.

What down is treated apparently being breathing only yesterday to your paper going on it feel like disarray.

Ok? So you got any chance last Friday he is saying that they got to find new ways to save money.

Everything is for grabs.

Everything is on the table.

One of those was clearly the pensions lock and that was the case Monday and Tuesday and the case this morning when James cleverly did his morning interviews on different TV stations and then what happened was Liz truss net With A Chance of this morning and they agree that the state pension would go out by 10.1% which is the triple lock and next.

And that's it, so I think he's feeling a bit silly haven't gone on the prime minister.

Essentially I think the having definitely big big u-turns by this girl but notably with the mini budget that was but I think the issue with one of of just it was unclear but it was and then they decided that not a U-turn so much is making a choice.

Do you pick up a struggle between the people briefing for the new Chancellor and the people briefing for the prime minister and it's always happens to some extent, but it's already quite pronounced and I think this was a brilliant.

Just in case actually that triple-lock because what does have is it makes me feel predator look quite silly in that they've all Sunday's front pages saying this is something that could now be scrapped the next day substances.

That's not the case.

You'll find it might be something that was a good one.

But I still think it just betrays I can chaotic operation there is there hasn't been in the end of an effort to breathe during this in advance is actually this is something that is unlikely in position to be able to make those cause and that you are very strong and very effectively because she's quite quite weak position and needs to make sure everything is the chance of getting your head.

That's what it would look a bit silly because the inflation rate haven't been sent ill this morning so arguably the prime minister and Chancellor could what to do and what number was fought for September that was announced today at 7 a.m.

Hours later the Chancellor Prime Minister mette to decide what to do about the triple lock and I don't I don't think that's unfair.

I think it was the fair last night for paper to say it's up for grabs and a lot of our readers of a newspaper or elderly.

That's a big issue for them.

So I thought we have to write things which cancer.

I think I think it all works as it should do and in terms of your experience dealing more widely with her people over the years and never asked to come out come out today to share the history of not being that.

Keen on doing interviews when she was at the Ministry of Justice I just wondered if that was your experience with our whether you found her easy to get on the get in the paper broadcaster has school children ask me questions when she was an Ender Dragon part of education.

I think she's I think she's a bit awkward in conversations.

She likes a kind of easiness maybe of Tony Blair Keir starmer David Cameron even I think she's I think she's going a bit of Steel today in parliamentary questions.

I thought she answered that question is quite well.

The problem is the country is laughing at it.

It's quite hard to cut a hard to pull it back from silent muted nothing was probably the most exuberant display of support for and that was on the floor.

So you know she's lost almost everybody which is I think close to unprecedented and if we think about the media in the media response to her and how its shifting the opinion polls it to be believed me know with a party heading for Oblivion at a general election apparently at what point do traditional toilet paper start to consider diction that or it's nothing you have a song came out for blarney.

99 me Chris how does a paper decide who do back a general election during an election campaign I do remember vividly when the sun backs Blair came out.

I think it was the morning of of a Gordon Brown speech the labour conference.

I thinking forgive me number 2009 possibly and it caused all a lot of Misery for labour.

They spent a lot of time at courting the Murdoch press particularly the Sun newspaper.

I wonder to what extent.

Has the same impact now as the internet matters more and you can't really say that important evidence that how our website votes I suppose it's discussion, are you do you send it on the headlines of Tony changed to remove things don't improve quickly and the man who was bachata.

Yes exactly but I think the thing is that then they're obviously quite frustrated with this is not the Conservative Party and you know if it does look like this.

Isn't going to fight the next the Tories so if she is the place before then.

I can't really message only see you know it's difficult to see these papers than making a switch for Labour only be more cautious, because they didn't have quite the same budget head.

Play primary budget headlines that someone wallpapersden probably yes, yeah probably but it still doesn't mean I mean into labour would require labour presenting these papers with and they want to back I think even the government going to collapse and supporters and because of something that labour is doing it because of the governments of states and governments actions.

Do you think we are over playing the influence of British Museum newspapers handed in that they still have the final Tory leadership hustings if you're politician it probably be about what the listeners of the LBC think about you, then you know what you know this number give you still buy newspaper thing is that wrong Instruments of the male in particular remains capable of resetting the agenda is the male decided to go for the next 6 weeks with stories about immigration or stories about small boats the toys traditionally would be the one stepping up to say where the only people there.

This problem and and although they proved that they can't all that day.

It's only haven't currently that that's the kind of thing that can shift needles elektrikli.

I think it it really can and with reference to the sun as opposed to to the to the mainland the Telegraph if these decisions are essentially taken by viscount Rothermere the Barclay family and Rupert Murdoch and Rupert Murdoch on like the other two nothing close to an ideology or any sense of loyalty makes more money in a stable economy, so if it does begin to look as if labour will bring some semblance of stability back to the United Kingdom then I can see them warm me to the Labour Party even in the absence of a detailed off as well in the advertising no interrogator is policies and for me it's been focusing on the producer not the consumer.

I couldn't tell you what they would offer to a telegraph reader.

I Could Turn what the offer is yet?

Labour when we start getting the areas they might want to tax can be quite difficult for our readership and maybe the males with a ship's I think currently the chaos the Black Hole chaos of the toys is sucking in their watch it 0 interrogation aware that what they're up to you and that may start soon.

It may not be so easy for them.


I'd like to bring back in Mark landler from the vets just understand.

How your readers are viewing the UK at the moment Tesco if I can start with you the European Union first enough possibly heads for the past 6 years constant struggle with with the whole issue of brexit which was a personal issue 4 European public for European papers and 44 in horse one is here in the UK since we have personally also directly affected by and

The last 4 weeks and now it was a particular sort of feels to ask as if this is the last battle cry of the brexit ideology of controlling with putting people in place who cannot stay even in in in Downing Street longer than a few weeks without making even more of a mess so the the viewing it's not very sympathetic of all this because I think they still have not completely forgiven Britain to leave the European Union but also because it really looks not as if it's successful in the canal between Labour and the tourist it might meet me know the next prime minister's a little bit more from papers here in Britain because they will not need.

Yellow crown one because it will come out of her relatively clear election without as far as we can tell at the moment.

So this would be quite an interesting period to watch know what happens now and Michelangelo your view our last chance.

That is not answer anymore was in the US for a little for a shorter amount of time that is expected to be unlike continental you're up.

There is a constituency in the US it would have been sympathetic to Liz truss was trying to do you know that the down economics and the laffer curve that is deeply rooted in Republican politics so Republicans are probably willing to give for the benefit of the doubt and perhaps privately even rooting for her, but I think the general perception is not unlike that we seen your ad which is you know puzzle that I can't country that is regarded as the most reliable perhaps Ally that we have is on a course that looks more like.

Risa Italy you know in terms of its economic policy analyst intern I think that Dad's probably the overwhelming impression in the US to cover Britain is there a way that they might not have been there is always been a big appetite to cover Britain but it's time for some of us including my newspapers for the larger now that it has ever been because you're more of a global news station and we were a decade ago and you know remember this all comes in the wake of the Queen's death which was an enormous story in the United States that resonated on all kinds of cultural and historical levels, so they go straight from there into this kind of Economics Circus 4freakshow is probably very bad.

Thanks a lot of people in the you are certainly my friends alright.

Talk to you at home or are absolutely play The Wanderer Liz Trust came from a house.

She never got in control of a country is 67 million people and as I said Charlie Dixon mobile leading economic voices have not helped her face and all.

Weighing Infirmary forcefully talking about how Britain's an emerging economy, that looks like it wants to be a submersion economy is Larry Summers had to say so but from a country that you know fundamentally very sympathetic to Britain ok and if we come to the end.

I would just like to have a bit of a kind of big overview thought if we can on the side of long-term impact of all this on the British media and what happens next James because the partisanship of ridiculous you have the impartial BBC you have LBC which is now I'm in the land for which covers all opinions were entitled we balance each other out and then you have Fleet Street where there's practically no body representing what both tester and Marcus just described as that Robbie Barnsley what one some gift the gift ideas to see ourselves as others see as and has literally nobody British 105000 the Guardian how many is the Mail Plus the Telegraph + the sun pasta mailonsunday plus the sun?

Plus the Times + the Sunday Times how many have I got so the British Public have been appallingly let down by press parents and right wing newspapers for the best part of 40 is in the last six.

It's become a national emergency obviously most of them are back in brexit, and if they weren't and her sister title was Media the media maybe it's tricky.

I think you know brexit did polarised opinion and James on different one side others on the other James lost others one.

That's probably him not really I think that we have a nest of singing voices on all sorts of issues and would you have headlines but we do carry out of spices and more Jeremy Warner and others who do set the other side of the of the argument.

It's just I think it's a healthy with a healthy Media if you wouldn't want to buy us we wouldn't exist so I think that's my defence Media that she could come.

I know with thing is breaking news today, but could you come round to her again the ones that supported her now don't appear to be done I think person she's going to carry on until about May next year limp.on I think and then there might be some moment against I think the toys can't possibly change leaving now.

They can't even allowed to try and deal with her keep forgetting but she really is an office not in power as a prime minister at the moment ok, and that is the End on I'm afraid with James nodding as he has been sometimes through this program, but not all the time.

Thank you so much for all my guests James O'Brien Christopher hope Elena career Mark lander and Tessa should give it.

Thank you all for listening the meteor shower will be back next week until then.

Many thanks, goodbye.

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