Read this: AI vs Studios, Radio 3 Upheaval, Vice Era Ends

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Hello welcome to media podcast I'm at Tegan on the show today.

I should we stop building studios in the wake of the AI developments.

That's what one investor is doing that was on the programme New Zealand Challenger channel dumps news and takes the country back to 1989 and vice closest websites can live on social media allow this changes at Radio 3 at yvr.

May not be the future after all and in the media queries we discover the talent driving change at some established brands that come in this edition of the media podcast did not acted quickly enough when the first complete came in at the corporations apologise to the boys parents GB news spent over £600,000 on conservative MP's over.

The according to the Guardian the paper revealed that just £1,100 was spent on labour MPs in the same period could this be the left with equivalent of the BBC highest earners list time will advice when you live presenters listening when singing of features to Hook onto the launch of channel four's the jury, don't ask members of the public to phone in with their own jury stories.

This is a big no-no 12-pocket CDs we will come back to me, but no they're Media law from the elbow first up.

It's professor this house professor Emeritus at City University and former VP of TV channels in you living in Bravo to see you so you lots of time a channel and I just recorded this that channel four Hollyoaks 23 episodes a week over on on E4 chance to have this is traditionally in this very white following but then that the audience comes around and

Follow them to see what it's saying.

I think it's there isn't quite the demand that there was and it's also warranty for anyway, so I wouldn't say it's the death note for the sofa, so I think the big days of the soaps.

Yes, and he used to be used to have huge ratings for also on all the channels which made them very efficient programs have on the network as well as Uncle Albion Market would like to take on and that did that didn't work.

They've got to somehow hit the site guys do note for two really work and it was the second Crossroads didn't work either so you can't just say they're automatic bankers and changing anyway now is changing about what people want in probably the soap reflecting everyday life is not what people want much more than everyday life so much answering Eldorado reboot, Eldorado

Yeah, so it was announced this week that Stephen Marron is Stepping down as CEO and will move to chairman of global interesting scenario because obviously he therefore I think about 15-years claim acquisition of you know out of home.

So it's not just radio.

It's a lot more than that so yes probably going to be a pretty tough act to follow to recruit the new CEO is interested of year long leaving party film and you're doing some podcasting yourself probably from the studio tomorrow.

What's on what's on the agenda this studio? I was thinking maybe I should think it would be.

I'm interviewing some people for kantar future proof podcast tomorrow the topic tomorrow is creativity high quality advertising and I'm going to be speaking to the CEO of travel company in Denmark and the ad agency and my colleagues here who who were evaluated the campaign for FC's Europe it was an award-winning called Dog patient the travel company identified that some people don't go on holiday cos they're too worried about leaving their dogs behind and so setup alternative holidays4dogs encourage people to take their human holidays a very entertaining campaign using human which we know is the one of the most successful drivers of effective advertising and he's not used enough so what follows the future proof podcast and then you get it when it's when it is out has hosted all you spending and so he can assess.

Future impact of Sora this is the new AI video generation tool from open aib is a big investor in usgs and sound stages of those being built here in in the UK to is he right to be worried.

I couldn't quite get his Drift on this.

He says he's worried as he rode on a moral ethical ground because so many people are the jobs to a I will because I hadn't trustworthy really worried because he thinks I'm going to punch my money into normal sound stages and then find that I could have done it for you now and 10th of the price or something is coming from on.

This is trying to have the cake in the hate me by saying I'm so worried, but I'm not going to invest in anything till I know if I can save money with it.

So it uses I'm sure like like me you looked at the sore looks pretty good one slightly strange, but they genuine.

Someone everything all how I do Television or film may have to change yeah, it looks on the face of it like and generative AI for video you know with all these new advised that's good actually you know replace normal production techniques my question.

They would be will they be differentiated enough? Will they all let you look a bit the same are they generic in the output even if you're being super smart with the promise? I mean it's the same issue is happening in advertising and creative agencies as well and you're not as always clips in a watch them all end of the and yes, they do look visually impressive the website of course in the snow in the boss of my phone was really weird sing along a bit let you know you have to expect that those those those technological leaps will happen to make things look a bit more.

But you know but you know do we have an emotional connection with them or do they just look slightly odd but we use video and lots of different ways film media and I think about giving presentations and sometimes you have like a slightly faded video playing in the background of something while you slides are on.

This is pretty amazing and it doesn't really matter and it's not going to Channel 402 be able to make Hollyoaks episode using this album between a bit too completely Clean Streets and why doesn't know it's not really like that, but I was thinking that has always been the source of the Dancers were people using coach to Poland and in fact we live in a very artificial well anyway.

I'll world a video on television is very often and I'm thinking of a friend of mine work on those big John's at Grenada in a jewel in the crown.

H and H at Pinewood or someone doing a back projection whatever it was supposed to be and it was just as artificial it just took an awful lot longer, so that's what we largely less or in the news.

That's what we portray.

It's the entertainment of artificiality people don't want the ordinary all the time in Jane will the Producers that do well from this ad creatives.

There was a mixed together what we know works and how to use this technology in your way.

This is what you expect.

I think the general answer with any question with ai generative.

Ai is it doesn't require an optimum balance between the technology and human input so you have to expect that at some point humans will be involved.

They will still be no stars.

They will still be active there was still be voices were generated as is a different question and they will still be storytelling that needs to happen, but you know happened behind the scenes so

What Tyler Perry has done is probably a fairly extreme reaction actually you know it usually sorts itself out in a balance you might find it for some genre is it's more applicable.

Maybe kids something like that.

I don't know but I think there's you know there is the uncanny valley issue going on at the moment even with Sora probably worried about the stock video business.

It's those sorts of things isn't it? Where you think I actually suddenly at the Lower End disc intellisnap or something that's alright to be concerned about but very much more in the in the area of information and boxing do find that quite a lot of that.

You do not know you're talking to even when you book a restaurant hi Emma I can be very disconcerting artificial I work a lot with Primary School children doing news clubs for them and they really do fall hook line and sinker for all of this artificiality forever trying to get out the iPads

Did the school covered any excuse to get the iPad look at themselves with a moustache on my stomach? It's it is a little bit and it's not just the kids stuff in England commercial TV Channel 3.

Would you sort of like ITV compared to the BBC here is to stop it's new service according to the broadcast as owners Warner Brothers Discovery it leave the key with many sort of One TV news provider the state-funded tvnz and they annoying music in a couple of the their own production and become a source of what we didn't digital channel about lots of repeats lots of imported material.

Is this a harbinger of things to come what happens in a smaller market 5 million people in in New Zealand when is less cash rock around the latter and you fight addition to competitive with ATP because I think there's a public service is under the broadcasting.

To do something something at the moment.

There's no reason to think that that is going to change and they have to fulfil certain applications because they have this universal provision through the transmission and so that's what that's the quid-pro-quo but the benefit of that quid bro.

I was thinking like that is Commitments as well by the American company a million miles away that they could look at this and go well at some point this Friday after the moment.

It is a million miles away at the moment are governed by the broadcasting after they do have to fulfil these obligations and the Kids on the Block have got to do these things and I think also there is no will in this country to stop doing this and there's no will probably in the channels themselves to stop doing these things in the items I read about this.

Cited the reason for this happening was because I'm falling out revenue it doesn't come down to money and it was interesting in our last live media reactions research and we interviewed a whole host of market is nearly 1000 markers around the world and of the channels that they wanted to advertise it in TV is no longer in the top five so it does kind of speak more broadly.

I think Tua trend of you.

No TV does need to do more to innovate to make it advertising format more relevant and fresher for consumers as well as well as market is so ultimately you know for me.

So it's a cost-cutting exercise.

It's a one-and-a-half billion to work out 1/2 million-pound add market in New Zealand which is super huge, so if you're already and then there's a change.

Advertiser behaviour you can be left holding the baby and it's not just getting a few people you have to sort of cut the actual service in the thing about news is that it's very expensive and there is a saying that is attributed to Rupert Murdoch they have no reason to me actually said it but it's quite a good one and he's saying was with entertainment you make money but with news you down at the wise house and people going to different reasons to look at GB news for example.

They got two major shareholders who are prepared to stand the the increasing cost and the and the expense of running at because they like having it is the different thing so you can still have commercial use depending on the model and if the model is the sugar daddy model you'll be ok, but in this particular instance.

I'm going to sugar daddy dependant on advertising in that is owned by Warner Brothers Discovery and there was the road news operations all around the world.

They said that you know it's up to New Zealand to work out its own budget.

It's not fair head office.

Selves going to their own issues and it helps them to have a sort of easy cash flow is that if you think about it news and itself in itself and advertising around these can be very divisive and it came to the full with covid-19 really when Advertiser start being positive about whether ads appearing is not just an online digital phenomenon it also applies to broadcast channels as well, and I think it might be a sort of reticence on the part of advertisers and again may not be just confined to New Zealand yeah, that's alright advertised on much more cuddling and sensitive about certain things now and the days when they just bought the massive eyeballs that there's those days have gone so we got a relationship with this time at Radio 3 radio through changes.

It's one of those stations that sometimes could be preserved in.

Because it's listeners can be quite grumpy necessarily up for a lots of changes and someone in Parliament to which that never helps controller controller Sam Jackson a joined around this time last year misses first at go of changes the speech trans are going over to radio.

This is part of them working out what they are is a brand today.

I'm not saying they're not good, but they don't seem to meet I do quite like Radio 3 10 things I like about it.

Is that I really enjoyed choral singing.

I'm into some stuff like that, but it's a big part of my life and lots of my friends of all ages have to say enquires and Radio 3 does Showcase British choral music choral music in a big way and it's

Sticking with your score little survives and so I don't think this is a really big change.

I'm quite into town by the people that fits with big criticism of BBC sounds that it's all celebs a fascinating discussion about what celebrity is that they've added you Holland having a very good musician.

He is and I think it speaks to a kind of paps and they mention this a kind of lighter touch all round so there's an interesting crossover now.

I think it reflects itself in the Proms as well.

We'll sort of orchestral music that's combined with something else.

You only think of you know Pete Tong it looks like a deliberately more popular spray and is presumably because you know they can't stand still with the audience as it is who are at the older and listening spectrum.

You know it makes sense to have presenters with broader appeal who are less specialist.

I thought Clive myrie was an interesting one.

There was a mention of him as well, and I think it's you know me to touch is important.

It's competing as well with classic FM to be very careful and has always had about 2 million listeners.

I literally for the last 2020 years and it goes up and down.

It's dropped a little bit recently.

It's always better round the same amount obviously Sam was to see at classic FM understands, what classic FM does but it's due instantly get accused of dumbing down whatever you do.

Don't absolutely awesome really really good stuff done at all like composer of the week if I can go with like I really enjoyed that.

There's a lot of good stuff.

I'm a bit concerned about the listening thing because it says in this site or total listeners per week 1.9 million, but is that reach or is that individual listeners always find this very?

And all the rest of it in the local radio which actually probably get five times is not treated and I didn't that's unfairness.

There is always that thing with the BBC isn't there any changes get a big response.

They one hand licence be paid to go to get something but the other hand you going to do something distinctive there always stuck between a rock and a hard place.

It doesn't worry me about you know when I'm doing the ironing actually it's not me that does the Radio 3 when I was thinking about brands, so breakfast as a brand mornings being outside putting in the afternoon concert brand around that it seems a more.

Schedule yes exactly and I also think it's an interesting You Know Radio 3 years around the BBC is a brand but they have to kind of design this lots of people can regularly kind of into and it's something that Pat's younger audience is a bit more used to you know you choose your time slot and you know what you're going to get that very very good reputation and Tilly as well.

It's more cap like is that you want to know what you get when you turn off the 1990s and this is the USB that we had to stream it the shower cross the week.

I'd like to still keeping choral evensong Wednesday by the way that last time to see if it's the BBC sounds commissions and Lizzie mention this evening into celebrity.

So they shows with Natalie Cassidy and Joanna Page right television Lily Allen and miquita.

Doing a double access world popularity celebrities are a great shortcuts.

So getting interested.

Then always tell him to great shows some do they write to the celebrity what I think is so funny is this a lot of his people mean nothing to me? This is what I think is changing about celebrity the day of that big household name is coming to put the idea that celebrity means household name that's no longer the equation anymore.

So good at the job and they bring an audience.

What's the problem? It's hard to find big celebrities.

I think it's all a question of balance for me.

So they may have chosen to publicise these names because it means something to some people but equally you know there is a role for the BBC which.

And I don't know I'm to produce and bring up on you know Talent that people haven't heard of its untapped you no one would hope that they were doing that alongside the big names as well.

I mean they have just launched.

Have a big new audio creators fund which features new people to audio new diverse voices you've got that at the same time perhaps the same push it used to be worse because of the big celebrity called I years ago audition for a presenter on Radio 4.

It's just a bit of have a good and I know that I didn't really good and I know that sometimes you don't sometimes.

You couldn't have been lesson.

Just don't even show me where the toilet was I got a lot on the way.

I felt totally unloved and I found out afterwards then very well, then celebrity was going to get the gig.

So close, and I wish I called them out on it.

Cos it really wasn't so it's forever and I don't think this is as bad as that but then I wouldn't well we're going to find out more about your ready for your break and after that will be back with more meeting so retrospectives.

What are you taking off on this week's around of today in history of the Vincent photography that Polaroid camera today in history with the retrospective 10-minutes every weekday.

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Here we go again running a small business.

I should be used to early mornings.

Stay ahead of the competition after all the early bird catches the lounges by the pool to put towards your dream Holiday by the bar as well the business the points of a pleasure business analyst are here for some more news in a voice Media is the closest website this week and mocking another decline of the generation defining brand both audiences and journalists exchange several hundred jobs her to go the company isn't shutting down entirely, what's the what's the new thing? I think the idea is that they're going to keep going on some forms of content but they're going to shut down the mainly the news item.

Split-off refinery29 which is more of a kind of content creation agency surprisingly divest themselves of that as well because they basically coming to the branded content operation.

That's more more like what they're going to do and you know when they first launch.

They were fairly radical is a kind of digital content production unit they did provocative content.

They did not look like so very costly sort of interviews programs that kind of thing again for me.

You know it comes down to add revenue doesn't it? They would keep going if they were if they're getting their the revenues for it.

So I think it's just a sensible trimming and realising that actually in advertisers are being more creative now.

They want new ways to reach audiences and you know new format for content production which are commercially funded are probably the way forward you know a stand-alone.

You know news content production agency.

Is a challenge now and and you know and you know there's a question about new brands and you know old brands.

You know the brands.

We know you know I tend to be winning in this space as lots of these newer stations that seems to be shutting down like BuzzFeed I think that size maged on an image and marketed itself to millennials with that and millennials get old you do when the audience changes.

I think it's just fashion now.

It's had its day.

Really loved it.

Don't let me just much advertisers want something different.

I think this relationship absolutely bellwether of our Society they tell us more about our society that any amount of surveys, what appetiser to do it and then moving away from this sort of thing.

Advertising looking data all the time aren't they and and sometimes to have an opinion, did you think based on opinion rather than the date of birth and they probably got the most data that is absolutely right.

You know and obviously we work with them a lot in a looking at different kinds of research weather is brand image research for advertising effectiveness and that kind of thing you know ultimately you know they do have a degree of control over what happens to large and small Media outlets because their funding them unless they have in a lasses media platforms have subscription channels or other forms of revenue advertising does Santa leave the way what advertising also does you know slightly play with the Wind you know a new format comes up advertisers will stop putting money into that in a media agencies.

Obviously have a role in The planning in the buying on this campaigns, but you know I think I think this is right.

It's a question of the brand voice didn't move on with the audience and advertisers.

Keen on that they want to be where the action is the issue is fascinating as well because basically to do something that might be a good thing might be a bad thing and I have friends who get terribly I write about the idea of say in Polish family is being forced by extra Christmas present so I can find work in social worker and you know advertising is not bad either because it can bring you two things that you didn't know existed but it does need in my view constant regulation as well.

So they advertised as do tell us so much that we don't know but they can also lead us very badly astray, so he does this need the advertising but we also need control on the advertising also the people that they were strippers Wade were investors, they have old Media

I do think that we were all going on the railway with coming along movies are not killed by radio and television and radio and it's always do you think it will survive on as a branded world or really is it is it done now.

Don't know don't know there are there are lots of other companies doing that kind of thing obviously and there are lots of companies who do specifically for formats for various different channels.

You know the big thing market is a looking at now is influences, which one growing in their appeal a year on year to my surprise to be honest, but then you know and they they morph into into different forms of content so who knows I think it's you know it.

I don't know how long they have you cash flow terms, but they have to I think make a big impact.

Quickly otherwise, it's it's not going around know what that impacts what the USP is over to the latest on the list Sony PlayStation at a close their London studio as part of some wider cuts over here in the UK was working quite a lot on VR gaming.

I can't I look at all of these sorts of different different topics something about faith in VR has dropped a little bit probably has been said of bubbling for a Bosch well over 1015 years now as the next big thing is going to happen next year and every single year it doesn't quite happened and you know we we look at side of movies with of totally immersive gaming environments and you know the Promise was always there.

I do think that there's there's some hope bringing coming back to the Jenny I conversation with Jenny I because

Gaming development is hugely costly takes a lot of people as me and see and it might be that Jenny I can actually produce some of those Concepts and environments you know in a more efficient way, but it does speak to the idea.

I think the VR is always the next big thing and you know you know it's still with you know headsets and whatnot which never have you always say this every headset released by the apple the Apple headsets is very expensive but pretty good immersive in but is more about a older men cereal even being sort of full VR yeah.

I just don't think it's a concept that really really works for human beings that's been with extreme.

I might do a bit of yourself to live your life doing that people watch say even now through for US television.

Would they really stink the head noun headset first year 4 hours a week with some people would but it seems to me that it's not something.

That's really going to take me on the game sign that she just on the individual be honest.

I just write individualist experience of a lot of media and then you wanted to tell you watch films together in a lounge and that's part of the part of the fun.

My son's were constantly sort of playing games that were you know involve shouting in the bedrooms are lots of other randoms around the match between Britain and Australia through being involved in the gaming environment.

That's not going to happen if you're talking to yourself and your house so maybe meet in the metaverse metaverse mentions, what the Clyde died last 12-months as well.

I keep coming back to this Media reactions research method vs.

Hugely popular with markers last last year.

They said they were going to spend 42% more on the better person.

That's kind of they've gone very quiet haven't spoken about that for a while.

Maybe there in the metaverse.

We just have a notice what they say.

I thought the service was a poetry on that be a very special VR environment this week on the future of kids TV about the chairs Media Foundation one of the key messages was at the government may need to intervene to prevent British culture being overwhelmed by international Productions of varying quality.

I mean this isn't a news story.

This is something that children's TV has space with Kimberly sort of accelerated by the government doing quite well meaning thing of removing food and drink advertising from from 10 years ago, but is meaning produces struggle to make a living or decide to make any hits content.

A market or however I do think that there's a market for British localised children's television.

I do think it is probably the job of the public service broadcast to do this.

I do agree.

We might end up with them having more obligations and they've got privilege.

It's doing that but it is destroyed them Public Service Broadcasting go but at this stage.

I think we could have some sort of protected environment not hugely, but just enough to make sure that we've got our own localised product.

Can I say that I'm a huge fan of CBeebies yes, I think it's absolutely wonderful.

I couldn't get through day with my grandson without it.

I'm glad you had a grandson and yes, it's very very important.

I am I can see why children's children's BBC did not have the same reach because that the children at school they come back.

They got other influences going on in the light but I do think.

Selected protected area might be acceptable Peppa Pig cultural export primecut cultural exports is that just an outline industry on single nearly 20-years ago actually when we I worked on the digital switch and to TV in marketing and children's ITV CBB CBBC were the channels that we spell logos to explain this is why you need to switch ever get more channels you get you know there's something for everybody and children was one of the key kind of drivers for that, but you know the reality is that the kids has the time not watching television now.

They're online and said they're on YouTube whether it's suitable for them or not conversation, but you know we do have to move with the times that the other question.

Because there was a very good children's content fund round for three years but wasn't renewed by the government and the radio as well, which was a shame because both of deemed to be very successful, but it doesn't put their hands in their pockets, but that was about television does this need to be about public service content no idea where it is? I think so.

Yes, it is about the content.

It doesn't matter what you think you can get confused between pre-school and children had a big is preschool and preschool is still very strong and we do very well with preschool in this country children's television if you like, it's different it's of the 5th.

It's more like drama Newsround which I think is very popular still and showing the schools and selling so be careful about that distinction.

I don't think you have too much to worry about with preschool children's programmes where we have the difficulty and yes, I think it would be a good idea.

If it was supported and everyone wants support problem.

Everyone some cash definitely right.

Just not time for the media this week.

I told Begin Again but a few brands and celebrities are rebooting this week in the news that can you tell me who they are from these cryptic questions so buzzing names if you know the answer so Jane you will say you will say let's play Begin Again after just 3 years who suddenly leaving Virgin Radio weekend of Graham Norton is a Graham he's off do we just off for a rest of your somewhere else? I can't work that at the seems to be some suggestion is going elsewhere that he could be going to Radio 2 for the Steve Wright's number.

I think he's just off arrest.

You got me got married last year.

I think so his life has changed it on the show.

Pop up on the gym.

I'm 60 61.

I've got a lovely husband.

I'm just going the weekends back.

So I think I look forward to this being true when he says keep on until next week.

Ok, who is Emma Barnett to be replacing Martha Kenny on Radio 4 Today programme down after next general election and I think 2 or 3 years now.

I remember her when she was the digital media correspondent at the Daily Telegraph and she was always interviewing us when we worked in and she's I think she's brilliant Ferocious and brilliant at the same time very good interviewer very Incisive I think should be great under today.

I think you'll be good on today.

We just seem to see.

St Martha's done, she's very good very sensible questions at the other so many good women on TV and radio can I use this as a plug my ex come back after 10 years to measure the number of women on standard flagship television news and when we started doing this statistic is 5 times as many professional about the members of the public or interview 5 times as many men in authority were interviewed and it got a lot better and it's even done and wants it was actually one in February 2018.

We've done 10 years of this colour and what having a big significance conference in June at the figures and I will tell you then.

I hope what it looks like.

I'm not entirely optimistic.

I think that sort of research for talking to people working news has made them think about it more.

some of this isn't the X-Men picking man it's just you want the whoever they produce criticism think about is enough and they don't think about the female options are and they got enough then they working with big ticket present as I really want to talk to people it's really important that happens to be men like them, so it's a difficult which format has just celebrated its 50th remake This Is A Business Show Business Show with a with some business experts on a panel and people come and suggest the right 53 make after an answer your version in Bangladesh

Game of Thrones goodnight all that stuff it's a very good title.

It's a very good format.

It works everywhere your business is the one universal thing across the whole world is going on isn't that and listen us to the shop taken in the US to and it's urgent here.

Yes, it has and it is I have to say addictive viewing cells.

Who are you know either be nice or horrible or rude or whatever they choose to be but it's also because you know you have to you on that you're on both sides as a viewer and in the business world.

We're constantly being courage to think what's the short version of what you want to say you know I'm not presenting a 97 page PowerPoint I have to think of what the bullet point summary of a piece of so you constantly thinking god that elevator pitches rubbish.

Why don't they know what they're prophet was in here to get something emotionally invested in both sides of the

What the net profits or loss of the all of that will be over those 50 territories that would be a good complete couldn't international complete off at the end of the new format well Jane you just slightly won the competition and as a prize you can go in our new evolution of the Dragons Den format around the chain why can people find out about what you up to for the future proof podcast on all major platforms to this one and left whatever not too well.

I've got a detective story out called the gardener in the graveyard.

That's I hope going to be making some headlines in June and look out for it on our website expert women project.com.

Thank you very much.

Thank you remember to be like Jane and usually Studios here at the London podcast studios where we give you 25% off your first studio booking if you use the code mediapad.

Just had to have the ones and podcast studios.com the 25% off with the code Media pod to the show make sure you follow it.

So you get every episode in your podcast app of choice and remember you can also look at you and see my lovely :-) in the Producers everything audio production and will see you next week.

How's it going is Jake Humphrey here from the high performance podcast I'm currently sponsored by Virgin Money at brilliant and straightforward way to invest for your future Virgin Money stocks and shares ISA is shaking up investing and you can get started from just £25 so you ready to kick some ISA search online for Virgin Money stocks and shares ISA to find out terms apply capital at risk Virgin Money is a trading name of Virgin Money unit trust managers limited introducing a new instant savings account from wealthify.

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