Read this: Radio 3 controller Sam Jackson on ending the 90-minute drama. Controversial song choice on Desert Island Discs

BBC sounds music Radio podcasts, it is good to be back.

Thank you for sending so many comments in while we've been off there.

There's been quite a star in our inbox over a recent episode of Desert Island Discs and there is a growing right over news the Radio 3 is ditching it's much.

Love 90 minutes Sunday drama, which means there is no drama left on the station.

I'll be talking to Sam Jackson Radio 3 controller but first we ignore the real life drama.

That's been unfolding in the past few weeks the global news cycle has shifted up and Gear from busy to momentous seemingly with each new day bringing the potential for events to reshape the world order has turned to Ukraine now.

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Good morning again from the German capital Berlin it is absolutely clear that this American government doesn't care about your up that is inclusion turn to the Middle East because Israeli tanks have been deployed to the occupied West Bank for the first time in more than twenty years as 40000 so Palestinians have left refugee camps in the North territory this time of maximum Turner feels a lot like a historic chapters been turned within just days in our continent.

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Gatsby and Holland premiere on BBC Radio 3 drama on Sunday the 12th of January the audio drama set in Harlem instead of F Scott fitzgerald's Thailand and it started shooty gatwa the current Doctor Who as Jay Gatsby it received very positive reviews but such audio theatrical plays will be ending on BBC Radio 3 with the news that it's no longer going to broadcast the 90minut.pl or Goblin King from Inverness is one of many listeners.

You contact to express his disappointment.

I've someone belatedly discovered that the plan is to act drama on 3 I think this is a mistake is it someone's the best and often just the best available on BBC Radio the only driver I listen to is it consistently challenges and delights in the way that Radio 4 drama does not the opportunities that presents to new and existing.

The television drama and not something to be thrown away likely, please reconsider its decision will see if controller of radio 3 Sam Jackson is prepared to do that when I talked to him in a few minutes time.

It's not only listen up in Arms the forces of resistance or Gathering an extremely.

Well written petition to save the drama slot already amassed 10000 signatures one of the organisations behind it is the writers Guild of Great Britain I asked it's co-chair Nicola Baldwin what it is that makes the Radio 3 drama so special to main reasons.

I think firstly that is 90 minute slots so drama on 3 is the only 90 minutes feature-length high-end, but there is but also on Radio 3 audio drama.

It's against music and that is actually quite special.

I was just seeing.

Marcia Griffiths on the Society of authors podcast and sent you purchase audio drama writing more like writing music because it's is a Sonic experience of writing for Radio 4 is it's a station that has a lot of news and current affairs you have a lot of issue LED drama and it looks really nicely Radio 3 is different it's poetic its expressive.

It's so much are not let you know and it special for so many writers because a lot of has got our start on Radio 3 when it used to have short commissions you know for new writers on the 3rd so the wire slaton and previous drama starring so we learnt through Radio 3 and we are able to experiment and Step Up 2 Radio 3 as well as working with fantastic at in any other situation for storytelling like that.

Of course.

She has been keen to point out that it is still the biggest to original audio drama commissioner in the

2:00 of drama on Radio 4 each year, I know that sounds like a lot.

It is a lot less than they used to be actually they also say they're looking at ways to increase the number of longer plays on you for to maintain a range of creative opportunities that you're talking about and I wonder is that enough for you clearly because of the petition it isn't I think that as I said you know for the reasons before Radio 3 is quite special Kind distinctive.

I think also Mum writers and producers.

There's a bit of an Trust because it's certainly around this particular issue.

We were initially told that the 19.

It's not wasn't going and the whole question of hours being eroded over time has become quite difficult for writers our concern is also for the Next Generation and generations to come you know there is right as I know who teach creative writing who student.

Discovering audio drama some of them didn't know about Radio 3 drama the new about all the podcast you have to pay for it and I think there's a question for the BBC about the way that promotes its own the time when it's never been to listen to drama on audio Katie him's writing the Observer yesterday said it.

Was you defeat from the jaws of victory at a point when 100 years into its career of broadcasting audio drama the BBC is now decimating its own output just as I've listened to it reactions the petition.

You've got 10000 signatures already any response from Radio 3 yet.

Not to the petition as far as I'm aware.

I'm home things that they will be willing to keep talking about this.

I think that so far as I'm aware there still in elements for discussion around this because of BBC is a public.

Pasta and we also have big concerns over the fact that audio drama is something you can listen to any time of life.

When my son was small when my dad was in a hospice.

We could we listen to radio drama even if there was cartoons on TV you can immerse yourself in that it's free.

It's suitable for people with the house down people ill and I think that there are reasons why the BBC is a public service broadcaster should provide that quality 90-minute audio drama content Nicola Baldwin coat share of the writers Guild of Great Britain thank you very much.

Enjoy night b and Jackson controller of radio 3 Sam thank you for coming onto feedback.

I wonder why did you decide to cut the drama to principal reason Andrea and thank you for having me back on by the way firstly.

It was about cost so the two most expensive things for Radio 3 at present or I'll live music and I'll drama on Sunday evening.

The context here, is it since 2010 between 2010 and 2020 in real terms the BBC's budget fell by 30% and then we had a couple of years of a flat funding and that has tax on every part of what the BBC does as I looked at that with my team it was very clear that the only way to deliver on that budget was to cut back on either a live Music and Drama and in the end.

I made the decision that live music for Radio 3 concerts every night opera on a Saturday the Proms of course over the summer was more important to protect our network than drama on a Sunday night.

It's an imperfect world.

We would love to be able to continue to do everything but it was driven by the economic reality of the budgets that we have secondly of the back of that we did then see an opportunity to sharpen the focus of Radio 3 as a music station important.

It is to you to listen to your listeners.

This conversation before and I just can't imagine that you made such an important decision with out some audience research and actually Karen Chesil from South East London was thinking something similar to appal to conclude that most people only want music.

Who did you pass iPhone 12 not only listen to Radio 3? I move between 34 and the world service a lodger in an unplanned way, but the three programs a checkout in advance a radio for Saturday and Sunday 3 p.m.

Dramas and Radio 3 Sunday drama the best of them all.

Yes, I love your classical music programs, but none that I make a point of listening to that.

I am giving not to miss Sunday my name is Donald hedge kiss from Southampton your messages were of rice.

Tyres address it seems to me or taken without any reference to some Donald and Karen outliers, then do most listeners actually want the drama to go we take audience feedback in many different ways everything that we do and it is about the audience first and foremost.

What do they want and how can we deliver for them? We were acutely aware that a change of this nature would be significant and the drama have been on Radio 3 in one form or another word for decades, so it was not a decision that we reach quickly as something that we discussed at length, but in the end the decision was informed.

Yes audience data.

Yes audience feedback, but also our own sense of where we wanted to take Radio 3 every quarter during the last year or audience has been up here on here and that is.

Result of what we've been doing to really focus on Radio 3 as a music station and talk about the classical music The Jazz and the other things that we have on the network some did you like the drama on Radio 3 I get the chance that you didn't think that fitted in very well.

I think there is a remarkable dramas that we've broadcast it's been hard and the other week is an absolutely remarkable listen and I think that we have created as applies have created many many years truly outstanding radio dramas, and it saddens me that we are not going to be able to give the opportunity to people to continue doing that I also believe again being honest with you that in this world in which the radio market has changed dramatically over the last 10 years or so having a very clear proposition that tends to work for audiences and I think in a crowded market being able to say that Radio 3 is a music station with classical music at its core and other music around the edges that we still have documentaries that we have interviews but they are music Focus

That future-proofed Radio 3 for the longer-term Radio 3 drama is actually unique and eating itself surrounded by music programs is different from writing for speech radio.

She says that it's not good enough.

Just to say that there's drama on Radio 4 response about completely understand why she's coming from that in an ideal world.

We would not have to make the cuts that we're making but against the backdrop of significant funding challenges and not having the money that used to have we're not able to continue to do everything that we did before I would add that Radio 4.

I know I looking at how they can commission some longer form drama.

That's not confirm.

Yes, and I don't want to suggest that will be at the same level the same number of the sort of 20 or so, please here for Radio 3, but it is something that we take very seriously we are mindful of any change of this.

Being significant and we understand that those who feel incredibly passionately about audio drama will be disappointed that does seem to have been hammered though hasn't had Amin Radio 4 dramas.

Also been whistledown in recent years.

I think new original and adapted drama output has halved on Radio 4 since 2018.

You have people like Dame Judi Dench and Serena McKay signing a petition about this 90-minute slot on Radio 3 supported recalling at the National Theatre of the airwaves and they're talking about the presence of this role in the ecosystem for writing for the theatre, and it is for the next generation of playwrights when you consider all that is it is easy to discuss.

Just saying budget issues.

I think it's really important that the BBC asks, how can we support new Talent what are the routes in for writers and indeed musicians and creatives of all kinds.

We have a really really.

Role-play at the BBC and I and I take heed of those comments from luminaries and others saying well if this doesn't exist what will be the routing for Talent I think that's a really really valid point in the end.

I think it is a question for the director of speech for the BBC and I can only speak on behalf of Radio 3 and what we doing.

I think there is a question about how do we support new writers Talent and I know that BBC director of speech and his team are looking at exactly what that might look like in future.

What could be commissioned on radio radio for that is not there at the moment from last year to speech radio programmes the verb and free-thinking moved to Radio 4 no drama is going everything you're saying makes me wonder if you're going to get rid of speech radio on Radio 3 not also to give you an example of one of the changes.

I made last year extended private passions are Sunday lunch time in TV programme to an hour and a half because

How good that program is how popular is with listeners and I felt I actually wanted to hear more in lightning and insightful conversation from a range of gas both well known and not we have a Sunday on Radio 3.

We have documentaries.

We have all sorts of content that goes out on the network and makes Radio 3 the rich tapestry that it is it will now have a greater Focus music and it has done since last April when we refresh schedule, but we certainly do not have any plans to change that programming and if anything I wanted to make more of it as evidence by for example extent that speech output.

I want you to hear what him rodri chatterjee has to say I do understand the finances of date and when does the keys obviously certain things need to be cooked but you do not come to those things that are the most valuable and BBC drama is incredibly.

Has been sold the at the radio drama the question is what makes lady with what is BBC distinctive and it is precisely things like the radio drama mix it distinctive and we see news what makes what makes you distinctive and what you have to distinguish you from everyone else Sam you've been accused before you've been accused by me on this program of wanting to turn Radio 3 in to Classic FM you are giving fuel to your critics.

Aren't you for that accusation that are ruining the distinctiveness of Radio 3 so what we doing on Radio 3 when we end drama is bigger A4 teapots landmark series on modernism inspired by the centenary of the great composer and conductor Pierre Boulez that will run for 40.

On Sunday night presented by to award-winning broadcast as an expert in that genre Kate molleson and Jillian more good luck hearing music like that on Classic FM they wouldn't touch it with a barge pole.

We are going to be commissioning exciting arresting programming that is a kind of you would never ever hear anywhere else but what would you say to him chatterjee? Who says that you cut the things that are most valuable in this BBC drama is incredibly valuable and has been over the years.

I think I hear that comment and I understand that for that one particular listen a drama is the most important thing the Challenge for somebody in the job like mine is like a go and talk to another list and he would say whatever you do do not cut the Proms somebody else would say that round Midnight is the Jewel In The Crown and now you're doing more Jasmine before on Radio 3.

I just want you to keep on doing it.

So it's really hard with an audience of around 2 million listeners every week.

We are a Broadchurch there will always be.

Ok son, we've heard from impassioned listeners and Nicola from the writers Guild but what makes it also valuable at this time there is such a Desire for order content worldwide is going through the roof and you know just this week.

I saw the literacy Trust released research showing that more children are listening to rather than reading fiction this young growing audience for speech audio.

You've got all these commercial platforms out there like Spotify and audible and everything some of them commissioning you drama and you are sitting on this Halloween brand this much-loved and revered brand with all this wealth of Talent and experience and you're throwing it in the bin and I wonder from a commercial arm is the new way that you that the BBC contains take this BBC 90-minute drama and and sell it elsewhere surely it could make money for the BBC Robin costing money.

I hear what you're saying and I think if I look.

Can you coming in everybody's got the headphones on people have got airpods in the growth of audio is incredibly exciting and we have seen at Radio 3 through facing the music and you podcast or through-composed the week the story telling the people are hungry for shows no sign of abating anything but so there is an audience there undoubtedly whether that is an audience that can then be commercialised in it is a separate question and I think a hard one to answer Sam Jackson thank you for coming onto feedback earlier.

I mention Gatsby in Harlem which was on Radio 3 January I will say no longer available on BBC signs it carried warnings about language and racial slurs that would have been Commonplace in 1920s Harlem episode of Desert Island Discs also contained a warning about the music selection which was racially sensitive but that warning didn't satisfy some listeners.

My name is.

On Birmingham and my feedback relates to the episode of The Life of near me Lethbridge enjoy listening to Desert Island Discs however, I was surprised to hear on this particular episode a disc which includes Direct racial references to slavery lynching in America as a licence prepare and a person of colour.

Don't think it was appropriate to play this disc Lawrence cast memory left till the story from the 1950s about a friend who worked at the foreign office and smuggled Band records into London in diplomatic bags when she was found out she was sacked this was one of the choices songs were very anti Republican very critical of the Governance of the Southern states.

And this is wonderful.

Would you mind introducing it for us? I want to go back to Dixie song by Professor Tom Lehrer and I should say as many mentioned this satirical song was written by Tom there in the 1950s sending up racist attitudes, but listeners might find some of the lyrics Gracie and sensitive.

I'm Andrew Edwards I mix heritage and I live in Camberwell in South London Road Plumley would be turning in his grave if you heard Lauren Laverne allow the song I want to go down to Dixie to be played on Desert Island Discs I listen to radio for a great deal and therefore was surprised and shocked that this song which advocates the Beating of black men's boots then lynching them while dressed.

In a KKK outfit to be played by the BBC on Radio 4 twice in the same week, I think that BBC Radio 4 in its own charter safe to say I've lost every confidence in radio for my name is avena Jamal and I'm from London the song chosen by nemone Lethbridge I want to go back to Dixie by Tom Lehrer was inappropriate to be played on her but the BBC still went ahead and played it is not acceptable in my view as the BBC know it to that's me done with desert island discs for now anyway an official complaint was lodged by one of feedbacks listeners the BBC gave us this statement Tom Lehrer is an American satirist and I want to go back to Dixie was written in the 1950s as a parody of popular songs celebrated the American South in.

Satirise, it's racism of the time from comfortable listening and we regret any upset it caused its intention is to condemn rather than to condone such acts.

Wherever possible we work to accommodate a Castaways music choice's on Desert Island Discs even when contentious as those choices on the reasons behind them.

I Central to program and we give careful thought to how best to include this track The Castaway no money left Bridge discussed collection of the song to her life and the presenter Lauren Laverne explained its historical context an anti-racist satirical intent and warned listeners about the nature of the content Desert Island Discs also received high praise for a recent episode with activist Nina Simone who campaigns for the safety of women and girls as well as police reform you may remember that in 2020 her daughter's Biba and Nicole were murdered in a country park.

Came to light that two policeman who was supposed to be guarding the crime scene posted selfies with the bodies in the background.

They were later jailed for misconduct Liverpool I'm listening to Desert Island Discs centre of students is 60-years just listen to me.

That's my god.

It's the best of all those I've ever listened to incredible every time I hear that a woman has been murdered at the hands of a man or a woman or a girl I go into at least two days of morning because I go back to that moment in time and then I come out right.

Ok.

Can I help these people I'm multimeric from Barcelona

The latest episode of Desert Island Discs with Mina Smallman was really touching on so many levels for me as a parent who has three daughters possibly imagined the very painful emotional and physical suffering that mean and her husband and George and have to live with regarding the worst possible to the parents dread she was so honest in her she dealt with the address for news with fraud her but somehow found the energy to become a huge social barriers regarding their disrespect for handling of the brutal murder of her mother of daughters in an area.

I know so well.

Thank you to all in this very sensitive production what I think.

This is a good time to remind everyone that feedback search for the interview of the year has neither gun.

Do let me know I've got an amazing interview first or indeed anything else that you would like us to look into this is your program.

So please do get in touch but for now.

Thank you very much for listening and forgiving me your feedback from BBC Radio 4 exemplar Series 2 the return of the award-winning thriller.

Set in the world of audio forensics pitch consistently hires Jason my opera scientists investigates doesn't feel right think it's hacked has been telling you but I did not say those words he's not annoying it's him but he's clearly convinced.

It's been edited he's not saying anything about what he thinks is missing from it.

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