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Help with TV/radio stations?
In this section
Friday, 17 February 2012
J
jb387:46 AM
Gay Skinner: There is a distinct possibility that it is the TV at fault, as I note that Guildfords BBC mux has a negative offset on its frequency and is something which can cause problems on some devices, usually if of the slightly older variety should this apply, other than that I cannot see any other external reasons for the problem.
I will say though that at stage one of the switchover on April 4th this offset is being switched over to the ITV mux until April the 18th, when at that point its being permanently removed at switchover stage two.
Maybe you could indicate the model of TV involved.
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sue220111:08 AM
Thanks jb38. I inherited a sky digibox plus card but as yet have no dish. I would like to know what is involved in setting up a dish and the cost of installing it. My freeview comes from a combi dvd/VHS player on a non HD tv. If I can use the digibox to receive freesat (once dish is installed) will I still be able to record programmes on my player from freesat? And will I still be able to access freeview on my player if I should want to? Thanks again
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C
CaroM4011:40 AM
London
I have four Freeview TVs in my house, but only two are picking up all the Freeview channels. The one in the loft room misses out a number of channels, including E4. But the worst affected is the one that I've just installed in the dining room, which is missing all of the major channels - it just has a handful, like Yesterday and Film4. The analogue TV installed there previously had perfect reception.
We live in West London and have a rooftop aerial which gives perfect reception on the digital TV in our living room and in our bedroom. (I don't know if it makes a difference, but both these rooms are at the front of the house, whereas the loft room and the dining room, where channels are not picking up, are at the back.)
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CaroM40's: mapC's Freeview map terrainC's terrain plot wavesC's frequency data C's Freeview Detailed Coverage
J
jb381:33 PM
CaroM40: I would really advise you "not" to make any radical changes at present even although the problems you are experiencing is most likely due to your signal being on the weak side, as this situation will massively change between April 4th and the 18th, particularly the latter, because on these dates Crystal Palace is completely changing over to high power operation.
Just out of interest though, what method is used to feed the aerial to the different rooms? is it done by a powered distribution amplifier? which of course is the correct way to do things. However when Crystal Palace does switch over if you then start getting picture break up or any other peculiar problems then it will likely be due to the signal being too strong, this fault can be completely rectified though by the inclusion of an attenuator in line with the input to the distribution amplifier, if used that is!
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J
jb385:26 PM
sue2201: Well as far as the cost of setting up a dish is concerned, I suppose its really the case of looking to see if there is anyone local advertising this service, as its possible to purchase a reasonably priced kit complete with cable for around the £30.00 or so mark from numerous sellers on e-bay, then all you would require is someone to install it for you.
As far as cost is concerned I cant really advise on this as it can vary dependant on location, plus because the domestic side of my activities is more involved as one of a trouble-shooter / improver as well as equipment repair so I don't usually get involved with initial installations as such.
As far as your other equipment is concerned it will work "exactly" the same as it presently does, but with the addition of being able to record from a Freesat (or Sky) box via a scart coupling between the two devices in question, "but" could you please let me know the brand / model number of your DVD / VHS device, as I notice that you refer to it as "player".
That being said though, I wouldn't really advise you to do anything until after April 18th as you will then have a better idea of whether or not the super high powered signal from Crystal Palace will manage to overcome the problems you have caused by the trees, as if by any remote chance it doesn't, then you can then forge ahead with the installation of a dish as this will enable you to view Sky's "free to view" channels, which up to a point just about level pegging with Freesat as some programmes are on one system but not the other and vice-versa.
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Saturday, 18 February 2012
B
Bill W11:14 AM
Apropos jb38's comments to Gay Skinner, Friday 17 February 2012 7:46AM:
Could you please elaborate on "mux has negative offset on its frequency"? Although my query does not relate to the Guildford transmitter, one of my set top boxes (a Tevion 48405) shows offsets varying between -635kHZ on mux channnel 24 and -664kHz on mux channel 52, all from from Sandy Heath. What is the significance of this? Is it a function of the transmission (doubtful, in my opinion) or the demodulation by this particular STB? I favour the latter because I seem to recall much lower offsets being shown for another of these STBs which I had to return to the retailer a few months ago with an unrelated problem. But if it IS the STB, are such large offsets a problem (or a potential one, perhaps indicative of a phase locked loop near the limit of its locking range)?
I also have a question regarding FFT which, for this particular STB, is shown as 2K on all mux channels whereas my LG M227WD monitor/TV with integral Freeview shows 2k on channnel 31 only, with channels 24, 27, 48 and 52 all showing 8k. Again, any explanation would be helpful.
For the record: of the several different STBs and two TVs with inbuilt Freeview (the LG and a Sanyo CE32LD33-B) I'm currently using, only the Tevion STB gives such detailed signal information, followed by the LG monitor/TV with rather less information. If there is any means of posting images to this forum (or e-mailing direct to either jb38 or Briantist) I'd be happy to send such details; if so, please advise.
Regards
Bill W
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sue220112:19 PM
Thanks jb38. I have made enquiries and it seems on the surface that it is the same price to buy and install a dish from one guy as it is to buy the dish myself and pay somebody to install it. I am going to wait until April to see if the ten fold increase in CP output makes any difference. My combi dvd/VHS recorder/player is a Panasonic with the capability of adding a sat dish so hopefully I can still use it. I was interested in your last comment about Freesat and Sky freesat. I thought the only difference is that with Sky freesat you have to get a card from Sky to watch ch 4 & 5 whereas with freesat you get all the channels that you have with freeview. Have I misunderstood something. Can you explain further please. Just to clarify, I only want the same channels that I have on freeview and I thought this was what freesat gives me (without the bother of getting a card from Sky to watch certain channels) Thanks
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J
jb386:58 PM
Bill W: Regarding the offset comment in the reply made to Gay Skinner, it was based on the fact that offsets from a channel centre frequency when of a negative nature have caused problems to a number of devices manufactured around three years or so ago, and of course by being unaware of the type of device being used I couldn't discount this possibility.
However the problem referred to is basically due (as indeed touched on yourself) to the tuners PLL off-frequency acceptance range being very limited to the extent that it refuses (or partially anyway) to lock on any frequency that's much under that of the Mux channels centre f, this difficulty as would possibly be expected showing up worse where weaker signals are involved.
The only strange aspect about this problem is that it doesn't seem to affect the same devices in a similar way where positive offsets are involved, or at least I haven't noticed any complaints, my theory on this being (as I haven't been able to prove it as yet) that the channel centre frequency on the devices involved is not actually bang on what it should be but slightly above it, this meaning a negative pull is already on the PLL when tuned to channels that do not have negative offsets, and why when attempting to tune to channel that actually does have an negative offset it struggles to pull much further down, whereas on the other hand never where positives are involved as its already slightly above the centre frequency.
This problem though could really be classed as one of yesteryear, as I haven't noticed any complaints of a similar nature being made where more recently manufactured devices are involved.
As far as the indications seen on your Tevion is concerned they just have to be incorrect, as even on a channel with an offset its only by 176 Khz, for a test I would normally have suggested that you scrub everything stored and manually enter the "frequency" (not channel number) of Sandy's Mux Ch52 then scan it and see what happens, and if it did pick up Ch52 have another look at what offset is showing this time, however on having a quick check at the Tevions manual I don't think it allows you to do that.
Regarding Ch31, as you probably will already know this is temporarily on low power, and it seems of a much lesser nature than originally, (possibly having been backed off slightly because of Crystal Palaces HD problem?) as I coupled up my South facing aerial to enable me to make a check on the 2K issue, but unfortunately the signal being received from it was just too low to register properly so I will make another check from an alternative location, possibly when mobile.
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J
jb387:24 PM
sue2201: Just a little correction, its really Sky "Free to view" channels although I do realise that it is shown as "Freesat from Sky" in certain headings including the one on the link below, but there is a difference between the two.
As far as using a card in a Sky box is concerned, you dont require one now except for viewing Pick TV (Ch152) so that isnt really a problem, the only thing I wondered about though is when you refer to your DVD / VHS combi being able to take a sat dish, what model is it? as I had assumed that it would be coupled into a box via a scart lead.
I also think your decision to hold off until April is a wise one, as you never know you might not require to purchase anything, but with regards to the price you have been given for the dish installation, should at a later date you decide to go with it I would first of all have it doubly confirmed to ensure there are no hidden extras, as the price is just too low.
This is a link from the site where you can see the comparisons between the various systems.
All free-to-watch channels | ukfree.tv - independent free digital TV advice
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Swifty8:34 PM
Can you help. I have an old amstrad dv3 sky+ digibox. Can I just plug it into a tv, buy an aerial and recieve freeview channels. Any help appreciated.
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